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towny44
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Re: Brexit

Post by towny44 » 11 Jul 2018, 19:29

Jack Staff wrote:
11 Jul 2018, 19:05
towny44 wrote:
11 Jul 2018, 18:55
Jack, no one can tell you exactly how leaving thel EU will affect you because no one knows, leavers hope that all will be well as we shake off the EU shackles but we can't be certain.
If you want certainty I suggest you try N Korea, you will then be certain that things are bad and likely to get worse, but if you want to stay here you have to be prepared to expect the unexpected, and like me believe that life outside the EU, even if we are poorer, will be far, far, far better than being in it.
Brexit is a cult.
Jedi warriors against the evil EU empire.
John

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Re: Brexit

Post by Jack Staff » 11 Jul 2018, 19:44

towny44 wrote:
11 Jul 2018, 19:29
Jack Staff wrote:
11 Jul 2018, 19:05
towny44 wrote:
11 Jul 2018, 18:55
Jack, no one can tell you exactly how leaving thel EU will affect you because no one knows, leavers hope that all will be well as we shake off the EU shackles but we can't be certain.
If you want certainty I suggest you try N Korea, you will then be certain that things are bad and likely to get worse, but if you want to stay here you have to be prepared to expect the unexpected, and like me believe that life outside the EU, even if we are poorer, will be far, far, far better than being in it.
Brexit is a cult.
Jedi warriors against the evil EU empire.
Brilliant :D . But you have got things the wrong way round. The remainers are the Bresistance against the evil empire of Dacre, Banks, Russian money....
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Re: Brexit

Post by barney » 11 Jul 2018, 19:50

So how did leave win ? By about 1·2 million votes. :problem:

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Re: Brexit

Post by Jack Staff » 11 Jul 2018, 19:58

barney wrote:
11 Jul 2018, 19:50
So how did leave win ? By about 1·2 million votes. :problem:
Remain polled 24.8%
Leave won by 1,269,501 votes.
What's the problem, apart from the vote being illegal of course?
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Re: Brexit

Post by Jack Staff » 11 Jul 2018, 20:16

“The British people have been duped by Brexit shysters” is now on the Hansard record. And what is Jeremy Corbyn doing about it? Nothing.
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Re: Brexit

Post by barney » 11 Jul 2018, 20:23

It's actually getting a bit embarrassing now mate. Go and have a drink. An illegal vote called by a legitimate government. Unless of course Cameron was an illegal Prime minister

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Re: Brexit

Post by Jack Staff » 11 Jul 2018, 20:28

barney wrote:
11 Jul 2018, 20:23
It's actually getting a bit embarrassing now mate. Go and have a drink. An illegal vote called by a legitimate government. Unless of course Cameron was an illegal Prime minister
Let the law take it's course...
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Re: Brexit

Post by barney » 11 Jul 2018, 20:59

Clutching at straws again :yawn: I thought it was the Russians.

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Re: Brexit

Post by Jack Staff » 11 Jul 2018, 21:27

barney wrote:
11 Jul 2018, 20:59
Clutching at straws again :yawn:
With a 'long arm' ;)
barney wrote:
11 Jul 2018, 20:59
I thought it was the Russians.
Who else could have funded such shenanigans?
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Re: Brexit

Post by oldbluefox » 11 Jul 2018, 22:10

Jack Staff wrote:
11 Jul 2018, 19:26
barney wrote:
11 Jul 2018, 19:13
All I know for sure is that after 45 years of membership only about 30% of folk thought that it was worth staying in.
Only 26.7% of folk voted out.
............and fewer voted to remain.

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Re: Brexit

Post by Jack Staff » 11 Jul 2018, 22:14

oldbluefox wrote:
11 Jul 2018, 22:10
Jack Staff wrote:
11 Jul 2018, 19:26
barney wrote:
11 Jul 2018, 19:13
All I know for sure is that after 45 years of membership only about 30% of folk thought that it was worth staying in.
Only 26.7% of folk voted out.
............and fewer voted to remain.
Keep up! Page 18 now,
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Re: Brexit

Post by oldbluefox » 11 Jul 2018, 22:44

Jack Staff wrote:
11 Jul 2018, 22:14
oldbluefox wrote:
11 Jul 2018, 22:10
Jack Staff wrote:
11 Jul 2018, 19:26
barney wrote:
11 Jul 2018, 19:13
All I know for sure is that after 45 years of membership only about 30% of folk thought that it was worth staying in.
Only 26.7% of folk voted out.
............and fewer voted to remain.
Keep up! Page 18 now,
Is that the best you can do Jack or have you convinced yourself that Remain did win the referendum?
By the way if you check your settings Page Number depends on how many posts you choose to each page so it varies from poster to poster.

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Re: Brexit

Post by Jack Staff » 11 Jul 2018, 22:56

oldbluefox wrote:
11 Jul 2018, 22:44
Jack Staff wrote:
11 Jul 2018, 22:14
oldbluefox wrote:
11 Jul 2018, 22:10
Jack Staff wrote:
11 Jul 2018, 19:26

Only 26.7% of folk voted out.
............and fewer voted to remain.
Keep up! Page 18 now,
Is that the best you can do Jack or have you convinced yourself that Remain did win the referendum?
By the way if you check your settings Page Number depends on how many posts you choose to each page so it varies from poster to poster.
True, but later on in the thread, if you were keeping up...
Jack Staff wrote:
11 Jul 2018, 19:58
barney wrote:
11 Jul 2018, 19:50
So how did leave win ? By about 1·2 million votes. :problem:
Remain polled 24.8%
Leave won by 1,269,501 votes.
What's the problem, apart from the vote being illegal of course?
So me actually typing "Leave won by 1,269,501 votes" kinda proves I have not convinced myself that "Remain did win the referendum". Though whether that result was legal is another question.
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Re: Brexit

Post by Stephen » 12 Jul 2018, 10:09

You just won't let it go Jack will you.

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Re: Brexit

Post by Jack Staff » 12 Jul 2018, 10:12

Luckily, for the country, I'm not the only one.
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Re: Brexit

Post by Onelife » 12 Jul 2018, 12:32

Hi Jack,

You have posted that the referendum was illegal (not constitutional binding) this being the case wouldn't that make a 2nd referendum illegal?

.........

The present Government have honoured the public vote, as would a labour party so perhaps it's time you form a new "Democracy doesn't matter party"?


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Re: Brexit

Post by anniec » 12 Jul 2018, 16:31

Onelife wrote:
12 Jul 2018, 12:32
Hi Jack,

You have posted that the referendum was illegal (not constitutional binding) this being the case wouldn't that make a 2nd referendum illegal?

.........

The present Government have honoured the public vote, as would a labour party so perhaps it's time you form a new "Democracy doesn't matter party"?
And would it make the 1975 referendum illegal, the one which kept us in the then Common Market?

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Re: Brexit

Post by Mervyn and Trish » 12 Jul 2018, 16:52

I've seen "the referendum was illegal"

I've seen "the referendum wasn't binding"

I've seen "we must respect the wishes of those who voted the other way"

I've seen "democracy is not one vote, it's an ongoing process"

I wonder if the same people would be saying the same things if the vote had been 52/48 the other way?

Would they be saying maybe you want to change your minds?

No, of course not. We would be stuck in the EU with "ever closer union" for ever.

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Re: Brexit

Post by Jack Staff » 12 Jul 2018, 19:32

Mervyn and Trish wrote:
12 Jul 2018, 16:52
I've seen "the referendum was illegal"

I've seen "the referendum wasn't binding"

I've seen "we must respect the wishes of those who voted the other way"

I've seen "democracy is not one vote, it's an ongoing process"

I wonder if the same people would be saying the same things if the vote had been 52/48 the other way?

Would they be saying maybe you want to change your minds?

No, of course not. We would be stuck in the EU with "ever closer union" for ever.
"In a 52-48 referendum this would be unfinished business by a long way. If the Remain campaign win two-thirds to one-third that ends it."
Nigel Farage May 2016
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics- ... m-36306681

So I agree with Nigel Farage on this point.
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Re: Brexit

Post by Jack Staff » 12 Jul 2018, 19:38

Onelife wrote:
12 Jul 2018, 12:32
Hi Jack,

You have posted that the referendum was illegal (not constitutional binding) this being the case wouldn't that make a 2nd referendum illegal?

.........

The present Government have honoured the public vote, as would a labour party so perhaps it's time you form a new "Democracy doesn't matter party"?
Why would a properly conducted referendum be illegal?

If Croatia had cheated last night, you (and I) would be the first to demand that we take the victory or at the very least a rematch.

Someone cheats in the Olympics, they have their medal taken away.

True the referendum was not binding, that's not the point. The point is they broke the law.
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Re: Brexit

Post by Stephen » 12 Jul 2018, 19:40

Who says? .

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Re: Brexit

Post by Jack Staff » 12 Jul 2018, 19:59

Stephen wrote:
12 Jul 2018, 19:40
Who says? .
Leave.EU fined for multiple breaches of electoral law following investigation

https://www.electoralcommission.org.uk/ ... estigation

But this is just the start. There's plenty more to follow ;)
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Re: Brexit

Post by Mervyn and Trish » 12 Jul 2018, 20:14

One campaign group breaking the law doesn't mean the referendum was illegal.
Last edited by Mervyn and Trish on 12 Jul 2018, 20:15, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Brexit

Post by Jack Staff » 12 Jul 2018, 20:18

Mervyn and Trish wrote:
12 Jul 2018, 20:14
One campaign group breaking the law doesn't mean the referendum was illegal.
Only if you are on the winning team.

The referendum was bought.

I would have thought that would have given you some food for thought. But obviously not.
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Re: Brexit

Post by barney » 12 Jul 2018, 20:20

Little mention of the 9 million that Cameron spent, of our money pre referendum trying to convince me to stay. I've still got my copy. After all I paid for it.

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Re: Brexit

Post by Mervyn and Trish » 12 Jul 2018, 20:20

Jack Staff wrote:
12 Jul 2018, 19:32
Mervyn and Trish wrote:
12 Jul 2018, 16:52
I've seen "the referendum was illegal"

I've seen "the referendum wasn't binding"

I've seen "we must respect the wishes of those who voted the other way"

I've seen "democracy is not one vote, it's an ongoing process"

I wonder if the same people would be saying the same things if the vote had been 52/48 the other way?

Would they be saying maybe you want to change your minds?

No, of course not. We would be stuck in the EU with "ever closer union" for ever.
"In a 52-48 referendum this would be unfinished business by a long way. If the Remain campaign win two-thirds to one-third that ends it."
Nigel Farage May 2016
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics- ... m-36306681

So I agree with Nigel Farage on this point.
You haven't answered my question Jack. I don't think Farage is one of the people trying to get the result overturned or made ineffective.

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Re: Brexit

Post by Mervyn and Trish » 12 Jul 2018, 20:21

Jack Staff wrote:
12 Jul 2018, 20:18
Mervyn and Trish wrote:
12 Jul 2018, 20:14
One campaign group breaking the law doesn't mean the referendum was illegal.
Only if you are on the winning team.

The referendum was bought.

I would have thought that would have given you some food for thought. But obviously not.
Obviously hasn't given Blair, a lawyer, and his cronies, enough food for thought to take it to court and win.
Last edited by Mervyn and Trish on 12 Jul 2018, 20:22, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Brexit

Post by Jack Staff » 12 Jul 2018, 20:26

barney wrote:
12 Jul 2018, 20:20
Little mention of the 9 million that Cameron spent, of our money pre referendum trying to convince me to stay. I've still got my copy. After all I paid for it.
Yeah, £9 million. I am still suspicious about that. No way did that little booklet cost £9 million!

What happened to the rest. Anyone seen Cameron lately???????

I too have kept it. Good for reference.
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Re: Brexit

Post by Jack Staff » 12 Jul 2018, 20:31

Mervyn and Trish wrote:
12 Jul 2018, 20:20
Jack Staff wrote:
12 Jul 2018, 19:32
Mervyn and Trish wrote:
12 Jul 2018, 16:52
I've seen "the referendum was illegal"

I've seen "the referendum wasn't binding"

I've seen "we must respect the wishes of those who voted the other way"

I've seen "democracy is not one vote, it's an ongoing process"

I wonder if the same people would be saying the same things if the vote had been 52/48 the other way?

Would they be saying maybe you want to change your minds?

No, of course not. We would be stuck in the EU with "ever closer union" for ever.
"In a 52-48 referendum this would be unfinished business by a long way. If the Remain campaign win two-thirds to one-third that ends it."
Nigel Farage May 2016
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics- ... m-36306681

So I agree with Nigel Farage on this point.
You haven't answered my question Jack. I don't think Farage is one of the people trying to get the result overturned or made ineffective.
That was more of a statement.
You can wonder what you like.
We just don't know do we?

But the illegality would have been ineffectual, so the result could stand anyway.
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Re: Brexit

Post by Jack Staff » 12 Jul 2018, 20:34

Mervyn and Trish wrote:
12 Jul 2018, 20:21
Jack Staff wrote:
12 Jul 2018, 20:18
Mervyn and Trish wrote:
12 Jul 2018, 20:14
One campaign group breaking the law doesn't mean the referendum was illegal.
Only if you are on the winning team.

The referendum was bought.

I would have thought that would have given you some food for thought. But obviously not.
Obviously hasn't given Blair, a lawyer, and his cronies, enough food for thought to take it to court and win.
Jack Staff wrote:
12 Jul 2018, 19:59

But this is just the start. There's plenty more to follow ;)
I have no idea what Blair is up to. There are plenty of other legal people on the case.
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Re: Brexit

Post by barney » 12 Jul 2018, 20:43

While I admire your indifagabibility Im kind of slightly feeling sorry for you now. #deluded

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Re: Brexit

Post by Jack Staff » 12 Jul 2018, 20:49

barney wrote:
12 Jul 2018, 20:43
While I admire your indifagabibility Im kind of slightly feeling sorry for you now. #deluded
The vote was bought.

Who bought it?

Why?
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Re: Brexit

Post by Mervyn and Trish » 12 Jul 2018, 20:56

No Jack. Call Me Dave tried to buy the result with our money and failed.

Having also failed to get any meaningful concession from the EU.

That's why we're leaving.

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Re: Brexit

Post by Onelife » 12 Jul 2018, 21:01

Hi Jack,

Apologies for replying this way as my tablet is jumping all over the place.


Why would a properly conducted referendum be illegal?

Because referendums are not legally/constitutionally binding they just (in this instance) show what the majority wanted for our Country.

...........

If Croatia had cheated last night, you (and I) would be the first to demand that we take the victory or at the very least a rematch.

They did cheat as did we (yellow cards) you just have to accept the result and move on.

...........

Someone cheats in the Olympics, they have their medal taken away.

And so they should.....The referendum was conducted fairly....The result stands.

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Re: Brexit

Post by Jack Staff » 12 Jul 2018, 21:06

Mervyn and Trish wrote:
12 Jul 2018, 20:56
No Jack. Call Me Dave tried to buy the result with our money and failed.
That was our governments advice to it's citizens.
Mervyn and Trish wrote:
12 Jul 2018, 20:56
Having also failed to get any meaningful concession from the EU.
We already have the best deal possible. But you just want more. Always.
Wait and see what we get now.
Mervyn and Trish wrote:
12 Jul 2018, 20:56
That's why we're leaving.
We can have our cake and eat it is why we are leaving. Only we can't.
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Re: Brexit

Post by Jack Staff » 12 Jul 2018, 21:08

Onelife wrote:
12 Jul 2018, 21:01
Hi Jack,

Apologies for replying this way as my tablet is jumping all over the place.


Why would a properly conducted referendum be illegal?

Because referendums are not legally/constitutionally binding they just (in this instance) show what the majority wanted for our Country.

...........

If Croatia had cheated last night, you (and I) would be the first to demand that we take the victory or at the very least a rematch.

They did cheat as did we (yellow cards) you just have to accept the result and move on.

...........

Someone cheats in the Olympics, they have their medal taken away.

And so they should.....The referendum was conducted fairly....The result stands.
No, it broke the law. If it was legal I would just accept that and simply campaign for us to rejoin.
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Re: Brexit

Post by Onelife » 12 Jul 2018, 21:31

Jack Staff wrote:
12 Jul 2018, 21:08
Onelife wrote:
12 Jul 2018, 21:01
Hi Jack,

Apologies for replying this way as my tablet is jumping all over the place.


Why would a properly conducted referendum be illegal?

Because referendums are not legally/constitutionally binding they just (in this instance) show what the majority wanted for our Country.

...........

If Croatia had cheated last night, you (and I) would be the first to demand that we take the victory or at the very least a rematch.

They did cheat as did we (yellow cards) you just have to accept the result and move on.

...........

Someone cheats in the Olympics, they have their medal taken away.

And so they should.....The referendum was conducted fairly....The result stands.
No, it broke the law. If it was legal I would just accept that and simply campaign for us to rejoin.
Must be a EU law cos l ain't got a clue which law you are referring too?

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Re: Brexit

Post by Jack Staff » 12 Jul 2018, 21:38

Onelife wrote:
12 Jul 2018, 21:31
Must be a EU law cos l ain't got a clue which law you are referring too?
https://www.electoralcommission.org.uk/ ... estigation
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Re: Brexit

Post by Onelife » 12 Jul 2018, 21:54

Can't open link.

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Re: Brexit

Post by Jack Staff » 12 Jul 2018, 22:00

Onelife wrote:
12 Jul 2018, 21:54
Can't open link.
Works for me, but try this (not the horses mouth) https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-44080096
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Re: Brexit

Post by towny44 » 12 Jul 2018, 22:10

It says that leave EU breached electoral commission rules but unfortunately for you Jack this in no way invalidates the result of the referendum, only that leave EU spent more than it should and did not submit accurate spending returns.
You really should brush up on election law.
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Re: Brexit

Post by Jack Staff » 12 Jul 2018, 22:19

towny44 wrote:
12 Jul 2018, 22:10
It says that leave EU breached electoral commission rules but unfortunately for you Jack this in no way invalidates the result of the referendum, only that leave EU spent more than it should and did not submit accurate spending returns.
You really should brush up on election law.
That's funny, I read that and I saw the word law, but you see the word rule.

It's not a rule, it is the law.

That's Leave EU.

How about Vote Leave? Are they just little tinkers who bent the the rules too?
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-42055523
This is ongoing before you say old news.

Yes, there is much more.
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Re: Brexit

Post by towny44 » 12 Jul 2018, 22:42

Jack, the electoral commission can only fine transgressors, that is political parties or campaign groups, regardless of how severe the transgression it would never invalidate an election result. It could of course prevent the party or organisation from taking part in any future campaign, but I don't think LeaveEU will need to campaign again, unless or until the Lib Dems form a govt. and apply to rejoin the EU, and then they could rename themselves LeaveEU-3016, or something similar.
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Re: Brexit

Post by Jack Staff » 12 Jul 2018, 22:50

towny44 wrote:
12 Jul 2018, 22:42
Jack, the electoral commission can only fine transgressors, that is political parties or campaign groups, regardless of how severe the transgression it would never invalidate an election result. It could of course prevent the party or organisation from taking part in any future campaign, but I don't think LeaveEU will need to campaign again, unless or until the Lib Dems form a govt. and apply to rejoin the EU, and then they could rename themselves LeaveEU-3016, or something similar.
So that's alright then.
The future of our country has been usurped by a lot of money from somewhere and we just accept it.
You got the result you want by fair means or foul.
Well done.
Call yourself British?
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Re: Brexit

Post by towny44 » 12 Jul 2018, 22:55

Jack Staff wrote:
12 Jul 2018, 22:50
towny44 wrote:
12 Jul 2018, 22:42
Jack, the electoral commission can only fine transgressors, that is political parties or campaign groups, regardless of how severe the transgression it would never invalidate an election result. It could of course prevent the party or organisation from taking part in any future campaign, but I don't think LeaveEU will need to campaign again, unless or until the Lib Dems form a govt. and apply to rejoin the EU, and then they could rename themselves LeaveEU-3016, or something similar.
So that's alright then.
The future of our country has been usurped by a lot of money from somewhere and we just accept it.
You got the result you want by fair means or foul.
Well done.
Call yourself British?
Do grow up and grow a pair Jack, your childish whining and wailing just because you lost is beginning to irritate. :sarcasm: :lol:
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Re: Brexit

Post by Onelife » 12 Jul 2018, 22:59

Thanks Jack.....l 'jumped' straight to it

£77K ....Is hardly enough to keep Mr farage in beer money for a year.

As is the case with all political motivated campaigns It appears both campaign groups had their finger in the pie at one time or another.

I hardly think this constitutes a none and void referendum.














Jack Staff wrote:
12 Jul 2018, 21:38
Onelife wrote:
12 Jul 2018, 21:31
Must be a EU law cos l ain't got a clue which law you are referring too?
https://www.electoralcommission.org.uk/ ... estigation

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Jack Staff
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Re: Brexit

Post by Jack Staff » 12 Jul 2018, 23:08

towny44 wrote:
12 Jul 2018, 22:55
Do grow up and grow a pair Jack, your childish whining and wailing just because you lost is beginning to irritate. :sarcasm: :lol:
Exactly. Leavers need to know they got the result because they cheated. They do not represent the people. We will rejoin if we ever leave.
If they are * irritated * all well and good.



*Spell checker did this and I just had to leave it! :lol:

Content edited :wave:
Last edited by Manoverboard on 13 Jul 2018, 09:58, edited 1 time in total.
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Jack Staff
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Re: Brexit

Post by Jack Staff » 12 Jul 2018, 23:10

Onelife wrote:
12 Jul 2018, 22:59
Thanks Jack.....l 'jumped' straight to it

£77K ....Is hardly enough to keep Mr farage in beer money for a year.

As is the case with all political motivated campaigns It appears both campaign groups had their finger in the pie at one time or another.

I hardly think this constitutes a none and void referendum.
Iceberg, tip.
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oldbluefox
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Re: Brexit

Post by oldbluefox » 12 Jul 2018, 23:52

Jack Staff wrote:
12 Jul 2018, 23:08
Exactly. Leavers need to know they got the result because they cheated. They do not represent the people. We will rejoin if we ever leave.
You seem now to be clutching at any straw blowing in the wind and your arguments are becoming more and more preposterous. That is the biggest load of old hogwash so far.

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Jack Staff
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Re: Brexit

Post by Jack Staff » 12 Jul 2018, 23:55

oldbluefox wrote:
12 Jul 2018, 23:52
Jack Staff wrote:
12 Jul 2018, 23:08
Exactly. Leavers need to know they got the result because they cheated. They do not represent the people. We will rejoin if we ever leave.
You seem now to be clutching at any straw blowing in the wind and your arguments are becoming more and more preposterous. That is the biggest load of old hogwash so far.
Which bit? That they cheated? That they do not represent the people? Or that we will rejoin?
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