Life After Brexit

[barney]

Interesting to read yesterday that of the 3 million EU citizens residing in the U.K., 4.2 million of them have have applied for permanent residency.
That’s so far. They have until June 21to complete.
How on earth can a country plan when there is no knowledge of the actual population?
Free movement is one benefit we’ll be glad to see the back of.

[Kendhni]

Interesting to read yesterday that of the 3 million EU citizens residing in the U.K., 4.2 million of them have have applied for permanent residency.
That’s so far. They have until June 21to complete.

That would have been a very interesting read ... so each EU citizen residing in the UK is is applying for 1.4 permanent residents.

How on earth can a country plan when there is no knowledge of the actual population?

For an answer to that you need look no further than Dominic Cummings (he of the bad eyesight)
“In short, the state has made no preparations to leave and plans to make no preparations to leave even after leaving.”
As he also said, British government policy is just a 'Potemkin policy" - that is pretty obvious even to the most blinkered.

Johnson has never needed a plan, he makes it up as he goes along ... it's not that he just moves the goal posts, it is more a case of he has fitted them with engines connected to a random number generator which determines which direction he is going.

Free movement is one benefit we’ll be glad to see the back of.

Some will others won't - you don't speak for everyone.

[towny44]

Free movement is one benefit we’ll be glad to see the back of.

Some will others won't - you don't speak for everyone.

Fortunately neither do you Ken, but Barney and I do seem to be on the majority side.

[screwy]

Oh dear, here we go again.

[Quizzical Bob]

Free movement is one benefit we’ll be glad to see the back of.

Some will others won't - you don't speak for everyone.

Fortunately neither do you Ken, but Barney and I do seem to be on the majority side.

Two against one out of a population of 70 million?

[Manoverboard]

Some will others won't - you don't speak for everyone.

Fortunately neither do you Ken, but Barney and I do seem to be on the majority side.

Two against one out of a population of 70 million?

But the counting is still ongoing ...

[screwy]

It’s a bit like Trump on here at times...
Referendum held,one side won, the other cried foul, jumps up and down demanding a replay,refusing to go quietly ie, we know best.

Oh dear. Rightly or wrongly we’re leaving.Suck it up and get over it.

[screwy]

To no-one in particular.

[oldbluefox]

The Tories won the election on a Leave ticket as opposed to Labour, LibDems, SNP, Plaid Cymru & Co who would have attempted to reverse the referendum result. Pardon my Trumpism but it was a closely run result not.

[barney]

Freedom of movement is a good thing.
Freedom to automatically reside and work is clearly not.

How do you plan for the future of any country when you have no idea what the population is currently and more importantly, will be likely to be?

"That would have been a very interesting read ... so each EU citizen residing in the UK is is applying for 1.4 permanent residents."

Another idiotic comment !

It highlights that simple truth that uncontrolled immigration from EU countries has either been widely underestimated, or successive governments have been cooking the books.
We've been told constantly by all sides that there were about 3 million EU citizens who were mad enough to call this basket case of a nation home.
That turns out clearly not to be true as every single person needs to be on the application.
They cannot apply for people currently not residing in the country.

Roll on January 1st when as a nation, we can actually have a say about our immigration system.

[towny44]

I have absolutely no problem with the vast majority of EU citizens currently working in the UK, having the commonsense to want permanent residency here.
Neither in the future do I object to anyone wanting to come here and work, but I do prefer they a have genuine job offer which is to all intents and purposes ongoing and long term, before they enter the country.

[oldbluefox]

On the whole I think those who have come to the country from the EU have contributed positively. However there are others who have not so the notion of an open border with the EU does not appeal. If they are coming to work and contribute to society it is no problem but we should have the ability to check who is coming into the country and what they can offer.
Considering what we were being told would happen after our decision to leave the EU I am surprised so many have decided they want to stay here.

[Ray Scully]

Perhaps it is time to look at National Identity Cards again. It would help quickly solve many problems surrounding illegal immigration and would have been a boon and a blessing during this pandemic crisis.

[david63]

Perhaps it is time to look at National Identity Cards again.

No need - did you not know that the Covid vaccine contains a microchip?

[Ray Scully]

Perhaps it is time to look at National Identity Cards again.

No need - did you not know that the Covid vaccine contains a microchip?

David your either a brave man or a fool, disclosing classified information on a public site ;-(

[barney]

Perhaps it is time to look at National Identity Cards again.

No need - did you not know that the Covid vaccine contains a microchip?

David your either a brave man or a fool, disclosing classified information on a public site ;-(

[Mervyn and Trish]

On the whole I think those who have come to the country from the EU have contributed positively. However there are others who have not so the notion of an open border with the EU does not appeal. If they are coming to work and contribute to society it is no problem but we should have the ability to check who is coming into the country and what they can offer.
Considering what we were being told would happen after our decision to leave the EU I am surprised so many have decided they want to stay here.

Not such a bad place after all then!

My recent stay in hospital cemented my views on immigration. A lot of the wonderful staff who looked after me were from abroad. But the majority of those were from non-EU countries. Because of EU rules getting a job here would have been tougher for them that an EU national who could just turn up. Outside the EU we will not be prevented from employing the overseas staff who bring benefits to the NHS. But we will be able to choose who we give the jobs to on our own terms. It will be skills that count. Not an EU passport.

[Kendhni]

Free movement is one benefit we’ll be glad to see the back of.

Some will others won't - you don't speak for everyone.

Fortunately neither do you Ken, but Barney and I do seem to be on the majority side.

Prove it or is that just yet another one of your many 'pretend' facts ???

[Kendhni]

Freedom of movement is a good thing.
Freedom to automatically reside and work is clearly not.

How do you plan for the future of any country when you have no idea what the population is currently and more importantly, will be likely to be?

"That would have been a very interesting read ... so each EU citizen residing in the UK is is applying for 1.4 permanent residents."

Another idiotic comment !

I was pointing out that it is obvious there must be some serious miscalculation going on - but comprehension was never one of your strong points.

It highlights that simple truth that uncontrolled immigration from EU countries has either been widely underestimated, or successive governments have been cooking the books.
We've been told constantly by all sides that there were about 3 million EU citizens who were mad enough to call this basket case of a nation home.
That turns out clearly not to be true as every single person needs to be on the application.
They cannot apply for people currently not residing in the country.

Have you just figured this one out? We were told over 10 years ago that we had no idea of migration in and out of this country.

Roll on January 1st when as a nation, we can actually have a say about our immigration system.

We always did have a say, but the our government CHOSE not to exercise that. What is for sure is that Johnsons policies will not make one blind bit of difference.

[Kendhni]

On the whole I think those who have come to the country from the EU have contributed positively. However there are others who have not so the notion of an open border with the EU does not appeal. If they are coming to work and contribute to society it is no problem but we should have the ability to check who is coming into the country and what they can offer.
Considering what we were being told would happen after our decision to leave the EU I am surprised so many have decided they want to stay here.

Not such a bad place after all then!

My recent stay in hospital cemented my views on immigration. A lot of the wonderful staff who looked after me were from abroad. But the majority of those were from non-EU countries. Because of EU rules getting a job here would have been tougher for them that an EU national who could just turn up. Outside the EU we will not be prevented from employing the overseas staff who bring benefits to the NHS. But we will be able to choose who we give the jobs to on our own terms. It will be skills that count. Not an EU passport.

I agree totally with you about the high quality of immigrant staff in the NHS.
Overall immigration, both EU and non-EU, has been verifiably proven to have been a net benefit to the UK economy.

As I said to someone else, we have always had the ability to choose who we give jobs to, but, for various reasons, our government chose not to exercise that ability. Looking at the latest proposals from Johnson they are unlikely to make much of a difference, only about one-third of immigrants came from EU countries.

The company I work for is over 40% immigrant workers - all contributing to the UK economy. I love the diversity.

[Kendhni]

It’s a bit like Trump on here at times...
Referendum held,one side won, the other cried foul, jumps up and down demanding a replay,refusing to go quietly ie, we know best.

Oh dear. Rightly or wrongly we’re leaving.Suck it up and get over it.

Try to keep up, we actually left at the start of the year.

[Mervyn and Trish]

As I said to someone else, we have always had the ability to choose who we give jobs to, but, for various reasons, our government chose not to exercise that ability. Looking at the latest proposals from Johnson they are unlikely to make much of a difference, only about one-third of immigrants came from EU countries.

Not entirely true in the NHS Ken, where I worked for a number of years. The NHS was obliged under EU law to accept EU health qualifications as equivalent to UK qualifications. Non EU applicants had a much more stringent examination of their ability to do the job. No-one said we had to accept them. This was reflected (badly) in the disproportionate number of EU nationals who found themselves in front of the regulatory bodies, such as the GMC, when it all went wrong. As it did on a number of occasions with disastrous consequences.

However the point you make illustrates the arrogance of politicians on all sides I've pointed out before. When people raised concerns about any aspect of immigration it was swept under the carpet, or worse derided as in the famous Gordon Brown "Bigot" incident. Had the politicians taken advantage of the powers you say that they had within the EU, we might not now be where we are. Major, Blair, Brown and Cameron with their heads buried in the Islington sand all bear more responsibility for the Leave vote than Johnson or Farage.

[david63]

We were told over 10 years ago that we had no idea of migration in and out of this country.

Not quite the same but I remember reading the headline of a paper (can't remember which one but that is irrelevant) some years ago whilst waiting to board a ship at Southampton, which said "Home Secretary admits he does not know how many illegal immigrants are in the country"!!

[barney]

We were told over 10 years ago that we had no idea of migration in and out of this country.

Not quite the same but I remember reading the headline of a paper (can't remember which one but that is irrelevant) some years ago whilst waiting to board a ship at Southampton, which said "Home Secretary admits he does not know how many illegal immigrants are in the country"!!

If they have entered illegally and under the radar, it’s actually impossible to put an accurate figure on it.
Similarly, Eu citizens could come and go freely and totally legally.
We have never had any control over Eu immigration, despite what our resident know it all says.
If they wanted to come, they could legally come.
Had we attempted to block that, the U.K. would have been acting illegally.

[Quizzical Bob]

We were told over 10 years ago that we had no idea of migration in and out of this country.

Not quite the same but I remember reading the headline of a paper (can't remember which one but that is irrelevant) some years ago whilst waiting to board a ship at Southampton, which said "Home Secretary admits he does not know how many illegal immigrants are in the country"!!

If they have entered illegally and under the radar, it’s actually impossible to put an accurate figure on it.
Similarly, Eu citizens could come and go freely and totally legally.
We have never had any control over Eu immigration, despite what our resident know it all says.
If they wanted to come, they could legally come.
Had we attempted to block that, the U.K. would have been acting illegally.

Get you facts right Barney. We could have had control over EU immigration but your government chose not to on the grounds of cost. Any stay by an EU citizen is limited to three months unless they are economically active, self-sufficient or in full time studies.

Other countries rigidly enforced this time limit. The UK didn’t think it was worth the bother.