Are We British Anymore?

[Dark Knight]

premier fox
why is what we think is right ,any more right than what is thought right by Muslims or Jewish people?
sounds like Jingoism and subjugation to me?

this is the same Britishness, that is such an embarrassment when we see Brits abroad, complaining about the food, the heat, the fact nobody speaks English and any other cliché , you want to throw in, history is not kind to us Brits, probably due to the fact we invaded/killed/fought with most of the world , in order to impose our "right way" on every bugger else
who is to say we are so right?

[Mervyn and Trish]

Why is what we think is right ,any more right than what is thought right by Muslims or Jewish people?

My point, as expressed above and earlier is that in modern Britain it appears that what the Christians among the population desire appears to be considered less right than other faiths. Equality should be a two way street and it isn't. Liberal numpties, for example, attempt to ban Christmas celebrations and display of the cross for fear of offending others, but would not dare to ban the festivals and symbols of other religions.

[Dark Knight]

from P E DANT
Hull branch

dear Poster boy
most of the Christian festivals and iconography are in fact a mixture of Pagan, Roman, Jewish and other religions, cobbled together by the RC church in an attempt to supress other forms of worship, which did not support their dogma
secondly British Christians follow a religion (C of E) that was invented so our lusty old king, could get his leg over with several wives, so as far as a religion, it is more a get out marriage free ,sort of deal

Thank you for you kind attention or otherwise

P E Dant

[Mervyn and Trish]

from P E DANT
Hull branch

dear Poster boy
most of the Christian festivals and iconography are in fact a mixture of Pagan, Roman, Jewish and other religions, cobbled together by the RC church in an attempt to supress other forms of worship, which did not support their dogma
secondly British Christians follow a religion (C of E) that was invented so our lusty old king, could get his leg over with several wives, so as far as a religion, it is more a get out marriage free ,sort of deal

Thank you for you kind attention or otherwise

P E Dant

Fair points possibly. But we should be free to do it!

p.s. And of course the militant Islamists have no wish to suppress other religions, which is why the bleeding heart liberals wish them not to be upset.

[Dark Knight]

from P E DANT
Hull branch

dear Poster boy
most of the Christian festivals and iconography are in fact a mixture of Pagan, Roman, Jewish and other religions, cobbled together by the RC church in an attempt to supress other forms of worship, which did not support their dogma
secondly British Christians follow a religion (C of E) that was invented so our lusty old king, could get his leg over with several wives, so as far as a religion, it is more a get out marriage free ,sort of deal

Thank you for you kind attention or otherwise

P E Dant

Fair points possibly. But we should be free to do it!

p.s. And of course the militant Islamists have no wish to suppress other religions, which is why the bleeding heart liberals wish them not to be upset.

or it could be they have all the oil and lots of guns? just a thought

[Mervyn and Trish]

So all we need to do is frack Blackpool, give all vicars AK45s and we can claim equality then?

[Silver_Shiney]

from P E DANT
Hull branch

dear Poster boy
most of the Christian festivals and iconography are in fact a mixture of Pagan, Roman, Jewish and other religions, cobbled together by the RC church in an attempt to supress other forms of worship, which did not support their dogma
secondly British Christians follow a religion (C of E) that was invented so our lusty old king, could get his leg over with several wives, so as far as a religion, it is more a get out marriage free ,sort of deal

Thank you for you kind attention or otherwise

P E Dant

On a point of order, Henry had many issues with the Vatican, divorce being only one of them. That he split the link with Rome because of the divorce issue is a common misconception. It would have been counter-productive for him to form a new "religion" to allow him to remarry every time he changed his socks when neither the Anglican church nor the Bible condone divorce. Surely, if that had been his intent, he would have set up an organisation that did permit divorce?

Of course, many people stayed faithful to the teachings of the Vatican.

The majority of British Christians do not go to CoE churches and certainly do not follow a religion. True religion is caring for the fatherless and widows - that makes many atheists highly "religious". Christianity is all about relationship with the living God, it's family. The modern "denominations" of Baptist, Methodist, Assembly of God etc arose because the founders were fed up with "religion" and denominational tags. Many Christians eschew denominations and consider them to be unscriptural.

[ITWA Travel Writer]

Out of the 41,000 purported “Christian Faiths” in the world I have yet to have anyone, lay or academic, who could fully define Christianity! So please do not bandy the term “Christian” about as being a particularly British thing.

Most Brits originated at some time or other outside of these islands, so why should the newer immigrants not have the right to advance their own beliefs, even at the expense of the diminishing minority of so called “Christian faiths”?

[Silver_Shiney]

It's very simple to define "Christian faith", John.

You believe that Jesus is the Son of God (most people do this, but it doesn't make them Christian)
You accept that He led a blameless life
You accept that you have rebelled against God - the Bible calls it "sinning" (most people do not do this)
You accept that the penalty for rebelling against the Creator is death
You accept that, because of His blameless life, Jesus is qualified to take your punishment for you and that He has done so
You accept that He rose from the dead
You ask Jesus to forgive you and "repent" (an old word meaning that you make every effort not to transgress again)
You try to live to God's glory every day while waiting for Jesus to return to this Earth.

That is Christianity in a nutshell.

All the various "flavours" of Christianity have minor doctrinal differences, the cults which masquerade as Christian have major differences and deny various aspects of the Bible. However, for those who truly believe (ie, are "born again"), it does not matter what the label of the church building is, we are all one big family.

[davecttr]

It's very simple to define "Christian faith", John.

You believe that Jesus is the Son of God (most people do this, but it doesn't make them Christian) NO
You accept that He led a blameless life NO
You accept that you have rebelled against God - the Bible calls it "sinning" (most people do not do this) NO
You accept that the penalty for rebelling against the Creator is death NO
You accept that, because of His blameless life, Jesus is qualified to take your punishment for you and that He has done so
You accept that He rose from the dead NO
You ask Jesus to forgive you and "repent" (an old word meaning that you make every effort not to transgress again) NO
You try to live to God's glory every day while waiting for Jesus to return to this Earth. NO

That is Christianity in a nutshell.

Mmm, this must mean i am not a christian, however i am british or I am if my Irish/Scottish ancestry counts as being british.

as far as I am concerned i don't care what other people believe as long as they mind their own business and don't try to impose their views on me.

[Mervyn and Trish]

Out of the 41,000 purported “Christian Faiths” in the world I have yet to have anyone, lay or academic, who could fully define Christianity! So please do not bandy the term “Christian” about as being a particularly British thing.

Most Brits originated at some time or other outside of these islands, so why should the newer immigrants not have the right to advance their own beliefs, even at the expense of the diminishing minority of so called “Christian faiths”?

No-one should have the right to advance their beliefs at the expense of anyone else. Full stop.

And I for one did not "bandy about" the idea that being Christian is a particularly British thing. What is a particularly British thing is the way Christians no longer seem to share the same rights as other faiths - in stark contrast to many other civilised democratic countries.

[Silver_Shiney]

It's very simple to define "Christian faith", John.

You believe that Jesus is the Son of God (most people do this, but it doesn't make them Christian) NO
You accept that He led a blameless life NO
You accept that you have rebelled against God - the Bible calls it "sinning" (most people do not do this) NO
You accept that the penalty for rebelling against the Creator is death NO
You accept that, because of His blameless life, Jesus is qualified to take your punishment for you and that He has done so
You accept that He rose from the dead NO
You ask Jesus to forgive you and "repent" (an old word meaning that you make every effort not to transgress again) NO
You try to live to God's glory every day while waiting for Jesus to return to this Earth. NO

That is Christianity in a nutshell.

Mmm, this must mean i am not a christian, however i am british or I am if my Irish/Scottish ancestry counts as being british.

as far as I am concerned i don't care what other people believe as long as they mind their own business and don't try to impose their views on me.

I would be interested to know why you said "no" to all the statements.

I fully agree that we should not try to imposed our views on others, but that is different from having a mutual, civilised discussion about differences, with both parties, if necessary, agreeing to disagree at the end.

Most Brits originated at some time or other outside of these islands, so why should the newer immigrants not have the right to advance their own beliefs, even at the expense of the diminishing minority of so called “Christian faiths”?

It is a fallacy to say that the number of Christians in this country is diminishing. Official figures show that church attendance is falling. Two things to note here: firstly, the number of "churchians" (people who go to church because it is expected of them, but have no real belief) is falling but the number of believers is increasing (two churches in my immediate neighbourhood are moving to bigger premises to cope with the growth); and the official figures do not include the "free" churches or the house churches (where groups of Christians meet and worship in a private house).

No-one should have the right to advance their beliefs at the expense of anyone else. Full stop.

And I for one did not "bandy about" the idea that being Christian is a particularly British thing. What is a particularly British thing is the way Christians no longer seem to share the same rights as other faiths - in stark contrast to many other civilised democratic countries.

It's not a particularly British thing, Merv, it happens in many other countries too.

[oldbluefox]

Do I detect a fashionable trend/whim to knock anything that is considered 'British', whether it be lifestyle, religion, culture or whatever? Perhaps one of the greatest liberties we have in Britain is the freedom to knock down our own culture and to embrace Blair's vision of a multi-cultural society at the expense of our own. Anybody resisting will be branded racist, imperialist, jingoistic etc.

[Silver_Shiney]

Do I detect a fashionable trend/whim to knock anything that is considered 'British', whether it be lifestyle, religion, culture or whatever? Perhaps one of the greatest liberties we have in Britain is the freedom to knock down our own culture and to embrace Blair's vision of a multi-cultural society at the expense of our own. Anybody resisting will be branded racist, imperialist, jingoistic etc.

I believe you are right, sir

[davecttr]

It's very simple to define "Christian faith", John.

You believe that Jesus is the Son of God (most people do this, but it doesn't make them Christian) NO
You accept that He led a blameless life NO
You accept that you have rebelled against God - the Bible calls it "sinning" (most people do not do this) NO
You accept that the penalty for rebelling against the Creator is death NO
You accept that, because of His blameless life, Jesus is qualified to take your punishment for you and that He has done so
You accept that He rose from the dead NO
You ask Jesus to forgive you and "repent" (an old word meaning that you make every effort not to transgress again) NO
You try to live to God's glory every day while waiting for Jesus to return to this Earth. NO

That is Christianity in a nutshell.

Mmm, this must mean i am not a christian, however i am british or I am if my Irish/Scottish ancestry counts as being british.

as far as I am concerned i don't care what other people believe as long as they mind their own business and don't try to impose their views on me.

I would be interested to know why you said "no" to all the statements.

I fully agree that we should not try to imposed our views on others, but that is different from having a mutual, civilised discussion about differences, with both parties, if necessary, agreeing to disagree at the end.

Most Brits originated at some time or other outside of these islands, so why should the newer immigrants not have the right to advance their own beliefs, even at the expense of the diminishing minority of so called “Christian faiths”?

It is a fallacy to say that the number of Christians in this country is diminishing. Official figures show that church attendance is falling. Two things to note here: firstly, the number of "churchians" (people who go to church because it is expected of them, but have no real belief) is falling but the number of believers is increasing (two churches in my immediate neighbourhood are moving to bigger premises to cope with the growth); and the official figures do not include the "free" churches or the house churches (where groups of Christians meet and worship in a private house).

No-one should have the right to advance their beliefs at the expense of anyone else. Full stop.

And I for one did not "bandy about" the idea that being Christian is a particularly British thing. What is a particularly British thing is the way Christians no longer seem to share the same rights as other faiths - in stark contrast to many other civilised democratic countries.

It's not a particularly British thing, Merv, it happens in many other countries too.

Simple really.
1. I don't believe there is a god so 'NO' is the appropriate answer to most of the questions.
2. That nobody leads a totally blameless life answers the rest.

[Silver_Shiney]

Simple really.
1. I don't believe there is a god so 'NO' is the appropriate answer to most of the questions.
2. That nobody leads a totally blameless life answers the rest.

Interesting, seeing as I was merely giving the definition of a Christian.

No normal human can live a blameless life, but as Jesus is the Son of God, He was able to - even His enemies agreed on that.

[ITWA Travel Writer]

It is a fallacy to say that the number of Christians in this country is diminishing. Official figures show that church attendance is falling. Two things to note here: firstly, the number of "churchians" (people who go to church because it is expected of them, but have no real belief) is falling but the number of believers is increasing (two churches in my immediate neighbourhood are moving to bigger premises to cope with the growth); and the official figures do not include the "free" churches or the house churches (where groups of Christians meet and worship in a private house).

From the last census the following was recorded:

The Christian population of England and Wales according to the last census in 2011 showed a 12.4% decrease and the number of those describing themselves as having no religion rose from 15% to 25% of the population.

[Silver_Shiney]

It is a fallacy to say that the number of Christians in this country is diminishing. Official figures show that church attendance is falling. Two things to note here: firstly, the number of "churchians" (people who go to church because it is expected of them, but have no real belief) is falling but the number of believers is increasing (two churches in my immediate neighbourhood are moving to bigger premises to cope with the growth); and the official figures do not include the "free" churches or the house churches (where groups of Christians meet and worship in a private house).

From the last census the following was recorded:

The Christian population of England and Wales according to the last census in 2011 showed a 12.4% decrease and the number of those describing themselves as having no religion rose from 15% to 25% of the population.

Quite so, those are the official figures. The reality is very different.

[Mervyn and Trish]

It is a fallacy to say that the number of Christians in this country is diminishing. Official figures show that church attendance is falling. Two things to note here: firstly, the number of "churchians" (people who go to church because it is expected of them, but have no real belief) is falling but the number of believers is increasing (two churches in my immediate neighbourhood are moving to bigger premises to cope with the growth); and the official figures do not include the "free" churches or the house churches (where groups of Christians meet and worship in a private house).

From the last census the following was recorded:

The Christian population of England and Wales according to the last census in 2011 showed a 12.4% decrease and the number of those describing themselves as having no religion rose from 15% to 25% of the population.

A number also recorded their religion as Jedi Knight, so what can you say?

But I don't care what the figures say. It has not been acceptable to throw Christians to the lions since Roman times. And it is not acceptable to discriminate against them now, even if there are only two of us left.

[Silver_Shiney]

It has not been acceptable to throw Christians to the lions since Roman times. And it is not acceptable to discriminate against them now, even if there are only two of us left.

You and I might think that, Merv, but the day is coming when it will be acceptable to throw Christians to whatever replaces lions. It's already happening in other countries

[Onelife]

Alan/Merv

I certainly hope you don't get gobbled up by lions or indeed anything else as that would mean two less to keep Christianity as the largest religion in this country....the alternative is quite frightening!!

Regards

Keith

[Mervyn and Trish]

Alan/Merv

I certainly hope you don't get gobbled up by lions or indeed anything else as that would mean two less to keep Christianity as the largest religion in this country....the alternative is quite frightening!!

Regards

Keith

I'm not that keen on being eaten either, though my reasons go beyond the purely statistical!

[Onelife]

As do mine Merv but from a diffrent perspective to yours. As Christianity continues to decline there comes the awful realisation that Islam will become the most practised religion in this country.

“When the sacred months are passed, kill those that join other gods to God wherever ye find them; and seize them, besiege them, lie in wait for them with every kind of ambush: but if they shall convert, and observe prayer, and pay the obligatory alms, then let them go their way for God is gracious.” And again: “Fight for the cause of God against those who fight against you: Kill them wherever you find them. . . . Fight therefore until there be no more civil discord, and until the only worship be that of God,” or “until the temptation stops.”—Sura 2:186-190, 212, 213; 8:12; 9:5, 124, Rodwell. 

Regards

Keith

[Silver_Shiney]

As do mine Merv but from a diffrent perspective to yours. As Christianity continues to decline there comes the awful realisation that Islam will become the most practised religion in this country.

“When the sacred months are passed, kill those that join other gods to God wherever ye find them; and seize them, besiege them, lie in wait for them with every kind of ambush: but if they shall convert, and observe prayer, and pay the obligatory alms, then let them go their way for God is gracious.” And again: “Fight for the cause of God against those who fight against you: Kill them wherever you find them. . . . Fight therefore until there be no more civil discord, and until the only worship be that of God,” or “until the temptation stops.”—Sura 2:186-190, 212, 213; 8:12; 9:5, 124, Rodwell. 

Regards

Keith

John 16:2b But an hour is coming that everyone who kills you will think that he bears God service.


Matthew 24:9 Then they will deliver you up to be afflicted and will kill you. And you will be hated of all nations for My name's sake.

Mark 13:8-13 For nation shall rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom. And there shall be earthquakes in different places, and there shall be famines and troubles. These things are the beginnings of sorrows. But take heed to yourselves. For they shall deliver you up to sanhedrins, and in the synagogues you shall be beaten. And you shall be brought before rulers and kings for My sake, for a testimony against them. And the gospel must first be proclaimed to all nations. But whenever they lead you away and deliver you up, take no thought beforehand what you should speak or think. But speak whatever shall be given to you in that hour. For it is not you who speaks, but the Holy Spirit. And a brother will betray a brother to death, and a father his son. And children will rise up against their parents and will cause them to be put to death. And you will be hated by all for My name's sake, but he enduring to the end, that one will be kept safe.

[Onelife]

"Better the devil you know" ?