Black-Market Immigrants

[Onelife]

Listened to a report this evening whereby a reporter went undercover for the day posing as a immigrant looking for work. The fact that he had no papers didn't deter seven black-market employers offering him work.

Whilst I appreciate black-market (back handers) have been going on for centuries however the present numbers of illegal immigrants entering into our country appears to be getting totally out of hand....should we be concerned?... Our David has said he's going to tackle the problem of black market racketeering HEAD ON!!..... Well If this is to be the case then we must presume he will be standing down as PM? Yippee! ...Shame i wish it were the case as he and his incompetent bunch of cronies have had ample time (years) to get to grips with this problem and yet they still keep coming.

In twenty years from now his legacy as PM will be one of 'not' protecting our boarders, the emergence of Islam as being the dominant religion in the UK...the demise of our culture and the 'fear' of freedom of speech....not forgetting 43... and counting policy U-turns.

Go... David you have done it.

[Mervyn and Trish]

And of course nothing like this ever happened before 2010........

[Manoverboard]

Small beer ... I think a far better plan for my mate Dave would be to clamp down on those unscrupulous folk living in the Midlands who pay ' cash in hand ' to legal tradesmen to avoid paying the much needed VAT.

[allatc]

I seem to recall it was Teflon Tony who opened the immigration floodgates to "rub the right's noses in diversity"

[Raybosailor]

Small beer ... I think a far better plan for my mate Dave would be to clamp down on those unscrupulous folk living in the Midlands who pay ' cash in hand ' to legal tradesmen to avoid paying the much needed VAT.

Mob why target the Midlands in your post ?, this sort of thing goes on in your back yard too.

[Raybosailor]

Bring in the National Identity Card nobody should be able to work without one and it should be carried at all times.
The idea of an identity card was met with a lot of opposition by human rights groups and others but I say if you've got nothing to hide you've got nothing to fear from an identity card.
Instead of spending millions building fences to stop illegals coming here make it more difficult for them to survive here, an identity card could have all sorts of information encrypted into it that could only be accessed by authorised agencies. It could help reduce fraud too as your photograph would be on it and if your allergies to drugs etc were on it a paramedic could save youre life by scanning it in a reader.

I was taken into an interview room when I was stopped at Rainbow Bridge at Niagara Falls, Canada and asked for my passport which I had left in our hotel room, " ok show me your driving licence sir" which was in the hotel safe with my passport. I was given a lecture on Canadian immigration and driving law and let go with a warning that I should have photographic ID at all times and it is illegal to drive in Canada and the USA without your driving licence on you.
We as a nation have been too soft over the years and now we are paying for it, I know some of you will not agree with what I say but as I said before if you have nothing to hide you have nothing to fear from ID cards.

[oldbluefox]

The whole issue of black market employment needs tackling. It has been going on for years and no government has the desire to tackle it. Other countries seem able to monitor work forces so why not us? Of course other countries also have ID cards which makes it easier to check who is on site. When this was mentioned in this country there was such a hullabaloo the matter was shelved/dropped.

[Onelife]

And of course nothing like this ever happened before 2010........

Sorry Sir Merv..but I must correct you on that point as it was as allatc has said the labour party that opened the floodgates to mass immigration and it is this conservative government who have done sod all about it. No point in harping on about how we got ourselves into this predicament the question is how we get ourselves out of it. The only reason this pathetic government sits on its a*se while our country goes to the dogs is because they are afraid of saying anything that may offend immigrants... mostly due to the fear of having a sh*t storm come down on their heads.

They need to grow some balls and do what needs to be done irrespective of who they offend.

God save the Queen and all that she represents.

Regards

Keith

[Onelife]

Small beer ... I think a far better plan for my mate Dave would be to clamp down on those unscrupulous folk living in the Midlands who pay ' cash in hand ' to legal tradesmen to avoid paying the much needed VAT.

Dear Moby..it is true that I have entered into such agreements when I was in business but I payed a lot less than the £2 an hour blackmarket rate that they can get now

[Manoverboard]

Small beer ... I think a far better plan for my mate Dave would be to clamp down on those unscrupulous folk living in the Midlands who pay ' cash in hand ' to legal tradesmen to avoid paying the much needed VAT.

Mob why target the Midlands in your post ?

Ray ... It's cos the OP lives in the Midlands, albeit not the East Midlands, and OL will doubtless spot the humour and respond in a like manner.

ps .... see above, thanks OL

[towny44]

I would like to see the mass movement of economic migrants and asylum seekers to europe controlled and reduced to manageable numbers, but to do this the whole EU must get off its a*se and create a sensible system. As regards numbers, despite the supposed attraction of our benefits system, the UK is taking in far less than France, Germany and Italy, so we should perhaps stop berating our politicians a bit.
When it comes to black market work, asylum seekers cannot seek work until their application has been approved, and as it seems to take forever one can understand why some of them try to improve their lot by working, even if it is illegal work.
The answer therefore is a united EU approach to asylum which should be applied for in the home country or nearest safe haven of the applicant. This should then be followed up by a fast track system to repatriate anyone found in the EU not in possession of the correct aslum papers.
This might not stop the illegal economic migrant trafficking, but it sure as h**l would slow it down a lot.

[Stephen]

Small beer ... I think a far better plan for my mate Dave would be to clamp down on those unscrupulous folk living in the Midlands who pay ' cash in hand ' to legal tradesmen to avoid paying the much needed VAT.

Mob why target the Midlands in your post ?

Ray ... It's cos the OP lives in the Midlands, albeit not the East Midlands, and OL will doubtless spot the humour and respond in a like manner.

ps .... see above, thanks OL

I always thought he paid in Kind

[Mervyn and Trish]

...despite the supposed attraction of our benefits system, the UK is taking in far less than France, Germany and Italy...

True, but we are a smaller and already more overcrowded country than any on those three.

We have 246 people per square kilometre.

Germany has 225, Italy 195 and France only 111.

On that basis the obvious place to settle them is France.

[oldbluefox]

Thank you Mervyn. They were the figures I was looking for. I can see little reason why France cannot absorb significantly more migrants. By comparison to UK it is a vast lightly populated country.

[Silver_Shiney]

While I believe a large number of people come here because of our over-generous benefits system, I received this at work this morning from friends in Greece, which gives a slightly different perspective:

"Yesterday we travelled up to the Macedonian border town of Gevgelija. You may have seen it on the news. Sadly the growing number of refugees is becoming unmanageable for Macedonian security forces, who fired tear gas canisters into the crowds of people trying to cross the border using what had previously been an accepted route. Images released by news agencies were very upsetting. Many were of families in desperation with police not knowing how to handle the situation. We were about 2 miles away, at the station, waiting for the groups who are being allowed to come through in controlled numbers. By the end of the day there were around 500-600 people waiting for a train while, reportedly, another 3 thousand were waiting at the border with more arriving all the time. The picture of the 3 little boys was taken by a BBC journalist at the border. You can see them just after Wilkie gave them toy cars a few hours later. They were much happier at this point, settled with their relieved parents, waiting to try and get on the train that would take them to Serbia.

Most of the people we met were refugees from Syria, Afghanistan and Iraq, fleeing from danger. One lady I spoke to had been a Nurse Manager from an emergency department in a hospital in Damascus, Syria. She was travelling with her sisters, cousins and their children, their husbands having gone before to take refuge in European countries. She wept as she told me how she has worked in the hospital for many years but could no longer cope with seeing such, "very bad things, terrible terrible things, especially with the children and so young people". She was afraid for her family everyday and so they decided to leave. She told me of the perilous journey they had taken and again cried as she spoke of how afraid they were for their children on the over-filled boats as they crossed the sea, but that they knew it was the only way to give them a chance. It has taken them 2 weeks to get to Macedonia from Syria, by boat and walking, and they were so thankful for the food, clothes and hygiene products (especially feminine hygiene) we were able to provide.

We met all kinds of people. Adam chatted with a surgeon from Syria who had a hand injury from the clashes with police at the border. We were able to give him some simple first aid supplies and food. He was visibly shaken but pleased that they were at the train station. They had been walking for 2 weeks straight, overland Turkey and Greece. We gave clothes and toys to lots of families from Afghanistan. These groups were amongst the poorest we met, many did not even have shoes for their children. Some wanted to talk and tell us their stories, others just held out a hand or grabbed supplies, not wanting to make eye-contact. Some people were smiling, happy to have basic supplies and to be a step further forward on their journeys. Many were sombre, clearly overwhelmed by their experiences. Some people had a very set plan of where they were going, Germany and Scandinavian countries being at the top of the list. Some had family waiting for them. Others had no idea, they were just running. We met a group of 14 young guys travelling together from Eastern Syria. They said they had to leave as ISIS were moving-in and they couldn't be safe there anymore. They didn't know where to go and even asked what we thought. What can you say? We don't have any answers for them, just basic supplies and compassion.

Those travelling with children were particularly strained and exhausted, both from having to carry the little ones and from the constant worry and uncertainty of what will happen to them. I found it particularly heart rendering to see how parents presented smiling faces to their children as they talked with them but then, as they turned away, their expressions changed to encompass a mixture of sadness, defeat, tension, exhaustion, and fear. It's difficult to articulate. Wilkie's idea of giving out toy animals and cars was a great one. Faces lit-up as they saw the toys. Children, who had been sat leaning against parents, were suddenly having battles between their animals and racing their cars up and down the train platform. I went back in the evening and saw a few of the children asleep, their fingers still curled around the animals or cars. We saw one beautiful scene where we heard a shriek and then a young woman came flying down the platform and threw herself into the arms of an older couple, her parents. They were all weeping and laughing and kissing each others faces. Many of those standing around began to cry and laugh as well as we found out they had been separated during their journey and, having no way of contacting each other and not having a plan as to where they were going, they thought they were lost to each other and would never see each other again!

CNN reported from the train station yesterday, saying that the refugees are relying on the kindness of strangers. We were some of those strangers yesterday but everyday our friends in the local Church buy supplies (using a little money Tommie has been able to raise) and make up a few food packs to help however they can. We asked the refugees what they needed. Food, water, clothes and hygiene products (especially feminine hygiene and baby wipes) were the main things. Some things we can collect and take with us but it is cheaper to buy food and hygiene products in Macedonia, also boosting the local economy. To do that, we need money. So there it is. If you can, please give us money for food and hygiene packs. You can do that using our paypal account or by giving it to xxx or through xxxx. If you want to put it directly into our UK bank account then message us and we'll give you details. £2.50 would buy a woman's hygiene pack (1 large pack of wet-wipes, a toothbrush, toothpaste, soap, elastoplasts, miniature deodorant and sanitary pads). £2 would buy a food pack (1/3 loaf of bread, a tin of meat, cheese, a large tomato, a cereal bar, a chocolate croissant, fruit and juice carton).

As we were leaving, a thunderstorm was rolling in and it began to rain. There was very little shelter for the hundreds of people sat on the platforms and the track. A few had tents they could use but not much space to put them up. As we drove home, we passed another 150 people walking in groups up the side of a main highway in the dark, many carrying children. It is heart-breaking. There are no words for how we felt and we get to come home to our comfortable apartment with all our stuff and a safe, fed, happy sleeping little boy. If you can help and be some of those 'strangers' showing kindness, please do. We will make sure your money gets to the people who need it."

Clearly, then, not everyone is looking to milk our benefits and, indeed, not all want to come this country. I think it was Keith who said about Islam becoming the dominant religion in this country, yet it's the extreme elements of Islam that these poor people are running from and the extremism they are fleeing is spreading in Europe's direction.

[GillD46]

This comes as no surprise to me, and I think is only the tip of the iceberg. I have seen first hand when working in General Practice, the appalling health of many refugees and the unthinkable situations many have escaped from.

[ITWA Travel Writer]

If it OK for all the British economic refugees harbouring on the costa del plenty; the pathosian plains; the algarvian fields and the beaches of al a France, then why are we taking less than our fair share of refugees into "Fortress Britain".

If it wasn't for immigrants, our NHS and a great many of our public services would have totally disappeared by now, so stop moaning. The UK like many countries in the world derived from being populated with peoples from other lands, so what's different now?

What's different, simples. Lock the doors. Put up the fences. Recruit more police. I'm all right Jack, or should it be "David".

[oldbluefox]

The 'I'm alright Jack ' snipe is an easy one to deliver and if this country was in a better position it could be better justified. However already our NHS is struggling, schools are struggling to cope, shortage of houses, lack of jobs, lack of investment in parts of the country, due in large IMO to overpopulation (although our politicians will vehemently deny this).
It was Blair who opened the floodgates to immigration. Maybe we could have taken in more and done more nowadays were it not for his policy of a multicultural society without a strategic plan to do with them when they arrive. And whilst there are 3000 trying to get into UK that is not the sum total.
It is impossible not to have sympathy for those escaping war zones but I don't think we can simply open our borders when we don't have the resources or infrastructure to cope with them.
Of course there will always be those who seek to make political capital out of the situation.

[Manoverboard]

However, John, the majority of British economic refugees heading for pastures new probably purchased / rented their own homes, had jobs to go to or were financially independent plus they were able to feed themselves and not be a drain on the host Country. More importantly, from my standpoint, is that they had also received a decent basic education.

Let us accept that there are only so many manual jobs available and the Brits will deffo get a tad ratty if they cannot get them.

I will always remember the experiment with mice where a few were popped into a mock mouse-housing estate. At first they behaved impeccably and were very sociable but as their number increased so did the problems and hostility ... eventually they were at each others throats.

Overcrowding, regardless of the case in favour, in the confines of a City is not a recipe for success and integration ... imo.

[Quizzical Bob]

If it OK for all the British economic refugees harbouring on the costa del plenty; the pathosian plains; the algarvian fields and the beaches of al a France, then why are we taking less than our fair share of refugees into "Fortress Britain".

If it wasn't for immigrants, our NHS and a great many of our public services would have totally disappeared by now, so stop moaning. The UK like many countries in the world derived from being populated with peoples from other lands, so what's different now?

What's different, simples. Lock the doors. Put up the fences. Recruit more police. I'm all right Jack, or should it be "David".

I think it's a case of 'I'm all right jock'. The south-East of England is horrendously overcrowded and there is a desperate shortage of school places, doctors, dentists, housing, roads and the list goes on.

I believe there's plenty of space in the wilds of Scotland.

[barney]

Part of the problem is that many want to come to London and the South East

If there was an even spread across the UK (inc Scotland Wales and NI), it wouldn't be such a problem

The critical housing shortage in the SE cause a massive influx in rent prices
£1200 per month for a semi is common .
In London it can be £1200 a week.

Bearing in mind our net migration figue for the last few years is +300K, do we try and build a city the size of Cardiff or Southampton each year to accomadate the increase?
In my opinion, that is impossible.

So the solution is simply more houses or less people.

The 5/6 thousand poor souls in Calais could be put on a ferry and transported directly to Hull or Edinburgh

Kent County Council are currently paying millions a year to home thousands of under 18 migrant children and don't get it back from Central Government.
It's a bout time others did their bit

[oldbluefox]

You could ship them all up north but they would all make their way south because that's where all the jobs and wealth are. Move industry and commerce northwards with an infrastructure to cope and many of the problems being experienced in the south and southeast would be reduced.
In these parts there are few job opportunities so there would be little to keep them.
The other issue is that of integration. Whilst some have freely integrated (mainly through work) many have settled among their own communities which have little contact or involvement with a western culture.

[Silver_Shiney]

Let us accept that there are only so many manual jobs available and the Brits will deffo get a tad ratty if they cannot get them.

Will they? Many manual jobs are despised by Brits and if it wasn't for the army of migrant workers who have come from other countries, essential jobs would not be done. For example, where the Lady C works as a cleaner, the majority of her colleagues are Polish. They used to be Somali, but they seem to have moved on. I have no problem whatsoever with foreigners coming here doing an honest day's labour and contributing to their adopted society, it's the ones who come here to sponge off the UK taxpayer, or cause a nuisance like the Romanians encamped on Marble Arch, that I object to. Then again, our benefits system is such that the likes of "White Dee" find it more profitable to sit on their backsides quaffing booze and burning tobacco in front of their 50" plasma screens, than to go out and earn a living. They view jobs such as my wife's to be beneath them (yet they'd soon complain if the shopping mall toilets were filthy). If they were to get "menial" jobs (which would have to pay enough to get by on, and the social benefits lowered to make it more worthwhile to work), then there would be no jobs for immigrants. That would still leave the problem of the immigrants who come here just because we are a soft touch. The problem, as I see it though, is how do you differentiate between the foreign scroungers and those who are genuinely running from their homeland in fear of their lives - to such our doors must always be open.

[Manoverboard]

For the past 50 years +/- that I can remember, since the initial tranche of Caribbean Bus Drivers and Nurses basically, we have evolved with fewer and fewer manual jobs and a related increase in the number of folk who are doing non jobs or are work shy.

That bubble has started to burst and the trend of hand outs for nought will slowly but surely reduce. It is inevitable.

If all the ' eligible ' born n bred Brits did eventually manage to find work, albeit at a rate that would be only sufficient to survive rather than to flourish, then those left including many of the illegals will likely trash this Country out of spite for being rejected .... we cannot rule that scenario out now let alone in the future when the numbers have increased way beyond sustainability.

For me ... our doors should only be open to those who can offer something in return, a la Australia plus a small quota for genuine refugees.

[Silver_Shiney]

Interesting that you mention Australia, Moby. My SIL is in the process of applying for an immigration permit. Amongst many other (expensive) things, he had to take a test to prove his ability to speak, write and comprehend the English language. He will also have to undergo an HIV test.