Making a fair contribution

[Ray Scully]

Looking at the situation surrounding tax credits makes me feel uncomfortable. We have lived through the 'golden' age of
covenants for our children attending Uni. gold plated company pensions and a ridicules 800+% rise in our property valuess.
Like many of our friends and contemporaries we now are regular clients of the NHS eligible for free prescriptions, bus passes, with some getting a free tv license, not to mention the winter fuel allowance. Methinks it is about time that those pensioners of adequate means like ourselves paid a fair share.
Now I have heard the response that we have worked all our lives, I just-feel that there will be few young working people today who having worked ALL their lives will be as lucky in old age as my generation.

Ray

[Quizzical Bob]

Speak for yourself, Ray.

Not everybody has a gold-plated company pension, very few in my circles, and I had to pay a lot of money to put my two through a total of seven years of university over 20 years ago. The rise in property values is not relevant, we bought a house and we've still got the same house. Don't forget that pensions are taxed like everything else so if you're receiving a larger than average sum then you will be paying more back.

[The Tinker]

Thanks for your concern Ray.

BUT I do not feel sorry for today's generation who get their rent paid, money to live on and only have to work 16 hours per week.

My generation had to go to work to pay our bills - we did not get any handouts.

I get fed up with the people applying for work who could work full-time (like the rest of us) and manage our lifestyles but NO they prefer to live off the state and get everything paid for. RANT OVER!!!!

[Mervyn and Trish]

I have two company pensions, both of which I paid into. I also paid National Insurance and claimed zero in benefits during my working life and hardly saw my doctor in 60 years, so if I have a few more aches and pains now I reckon I'm still in credit with the NHS.

I also saved up during my working life to help make retirement more comfortable.

That's not luck. It's forethought and being willing to go without some stuff during my lifetime to prepare for my later years.

And I still pay tax as a pensioner. So no, I don't feel I need to do more to support the low paid - or more to the point to support the employers who pay low ages in the knowledge the government will stump up with taxpayers money to bridge the gap.

I think the idea of moving towards a higher wage, lower benefit society is the way to go.

[Manoverboard]

Tax credits were a bad idea to start with, scrapping them deffo gets my vote but there needs to be more thought applied to those who are ' genuinely ' in need at the bottom of the pile once this change comes in.

Ray ... if you are feeling uncomfortable then donate the equivalent sum of all your unwanted benefits to a suitable charity, I worked my butt off for mine so will be keeping them.

[Meg 50]

My OH is self employed - no final salary linked stuff - it is all dependent on the stock market.....

He should have retired 4 years ago but was unable to since due drops in the market the value of his pension pot was smaller than the amount he'd paid in...

Retirement was postponed until there was an upturn. We now have a date - but it's still 18 months off.


If Ray feels he has more than his fair share (after tax) then as Moby says - donate the excess to charity

[barney]

As someone who is still working hard and supporting all of you 'benefit scroungers' I feel that it's very much each to his own

Everyone makes decisions based on their own circumstances.

I give my time and money to help those in need when I can but nobody should feel pressurised to do so.

To be slightly controversial, I think the generation difference of 'need' is now very obvious

Where we were mostly happy to accept hand me downs and live prudently, many younger folk have the attitude of need it all now.

I take slight pride in the fact that I've never had a loan in my life (mortgage aside) while many these days openly boast of their debt !

[GillD46]

My husband still pays tax at 40% despite being retired. His pension is good but still less than half of his salary. He worked 40 years in the NHS, often over 120 hrs a week in the early days and never less than 50 hrs, so we both feel he is entitled to what he gets!

I am not a tax payer, so when I eventually get my pension - after it has been deferred TWICE - I feel I will be entitled to that too!

[Dark Knight]

well done Raymondo, this actually made me laugh out loud

[qbman1]

I reckon he posted it, put on his hard hat and ducked for cover ! Bloody silly idea if you ask me

[Frank Manning]

The thing is Ray, we went without when we got started. No money = no telly, no carpet, no car, and certainly no Sky, no IPhone, no dishwasher, no washing machine, no fridge. We had to work for things and wait until we could afford them. When I see poor youngsters at Uni having taxis at 11pm to go out to the night clubs, unable to walk 20 yards without consulting their I phone and texting inane comments all this with cars on the drive of their HMO's, my sympathy for these whingers evaporates a bit.

[Ray Scully]

Thanks for your responses guys, not unexpected
Moby rather than donate a sum to charity, Maureen and I donate our time, and even at minimum wage it would amount to an appreciable sum.

Ray

[Manoverboard]

Moby rather than donate a sum to charity, Maureen and I donate our time, and even at minimum wage it would amount to an appreciable sum.

Ray

Very commendable but why do you feel uncomfortable .... perhaps it is guilt but if so, why and for what ?

[Ray Scully]

Moby rather than donate a sum to charity, Maureen and I donate our time, and even at minimum wage it would amount to an appreciable sum.

Ray

Very commendable but why do you feel uncomfortable .... perhaps it is guilt but if so, why and for what ?

Not looking for commendation or anything else Moby, but being the only Socialist in the village isn't easy.

Ray

[towny44]

Surely Village Socialist is an oxymoron.

[anniec]

I am not a tax payer, so when I eventually get my pension - after it has been deferred TWICE - I feel I will be entitled to that too!

In the same boat, so commiserations and roll on July 2017 (my state pension time, if they don't change it AGAIN). Grr.

[gfwgfw]

Almost skint but very happy living with my ferrets in rural Darzet overseeing Poole Bay listening to the Wirzels 78's on my windup His Masters Voice gramophone

Lubbooo all

Graham x

[Ray Scully]

From this mornings TImes

On average, pensioners have £394 a week after housing costs compared with £385 among the working-age population. Those in their 20s, 30s and 40s should be braced for lower incomes in retirement than their parents, he said.

The findings will fuel resentment towards baby boomers, who grew up during a period of rising living standards and have been shielded from the worst of the austerity programme. David Cameron and George Osborne have protected pensioner benefits and reduced inheritance tax bills.

Rising inequality between the generations is set to be exacerbated by £4 billion of planned cuts to tax credits for low-income workers, which have caused a row in parliament.

[Manoverboard]

.... ah, that's it, Ray fears that the locals will start throwing eggs at his windows

[Ray Scully]

.... ah, that's it, Ray fears that the locals will start throwing eggs at his windows

Oh dear

[towny44]

Ray, your points are all fair and some are more valid than others, but the Govt. need to reduce the welfare expenditure so that the country can afford to provide what's left.
As for inequality no Govt. is ever going to stop the rising gap and socialist Govts. have equally failed to prevent the gap widening. The best that can be achieved is to try and improve living standards at the bottom, and even you must admit that everyones living standards do continue to rise, with even those on benefits having big screen TV's and cars etc.
As someone benefitting from a gold plated pension I do count my blessings that I worked when I did, and I agree that our children and grandchildren won't have as high a disposible income as we do, but the changes in inheritance tax might mean I can leave them with something worthwhile to eak out their meagre pensions.

[oldbluefox]

It's a waste of time trying to convince somebody who was so hard up through their teens and twenties that he could not afford even a fraction of what our young people have nowadays. He was trying to scrape enough money together to pay the deposit on a house. In those days it was called standing on your own two feet.
We laugh nowadays at some of the things we did but it did make us appreciate what we have now. It would be so alien to the comparatively pampered younger generation they would not understand.
I agree that the benefit budget which boomed under the last Labour government should be reduced. However I believe the Tories have got the tax credit issue wrong and should only start cutting this benefit once they have increased salaries to the living wage. It could still be implemented by reducing tax and NI liability so that workers on low pay do not find themselves out of pocket.

[Quizzical Bob]

From this mornings TImes

On average, pensioners have £394 a week after housing costs compared with £385 among the working-age population. Those in their 20s, 30s and 40s should be braced for lower incomes in retirement than their parents, he said.

The findings will fuel resentment towards baby boomers, who grew up during a period of rising living standards and have been shielded from the worst of the austerity programme. David Cameron and George Osborne have protected pensioner benefits and reduced inheritance tax bills.

Rising inequality between the generations is set to be exacerbated by £4 billion of planned cuts to tax credits for low-income workers, which have caused a row in parliament.

These people just don't understand, do they. Inheritance Tax is no help to the older generation. They have to die first before anyone can benefit from it. The only people who are going to get this benefit are the younger generation. It's arguments like this that devalue the whole discussion.

[Mervyn and Trish]

On average, pensioners have £394 a week after housing costs compared with £385 among the working-age population.

As pointed out in some other papers, this is an important caveat that changes the whole picture. A major part of younger peoples' outgoings is housing costs, be it mortgage or rent. Most pensioners have already paid off their mortgage, which is why on average they are better off now.

The findings will fuel resentment towards baby boomers, who grew up during a period of rising living standards and have been shielded from the worst of the austerity programme. David Cameron and George Osborne have protected pensioner benefits and reduced inheritance tax bills.

Really? For one thing interest rate cuts, which benefit those in debt, have cost me about £4,000 a year in income from my savings. That is more than the average loss of earnings for younger people. Also older people are more dependant on services which have been cut in the name of austerity. And as QB already points out reduced inheritance tax does not benefit pensioners, it benefits the next generation.

[Manoverboard]

.... ah, that's it, Ray fears that the locals will start throwing eggs at his windows

Oh dear

Are you trying to suggest that yours was a serious Topic rather than a wind-up ... come on !!!

Ok .... howzabout ;

The ' have nots ' will imo have a down on absolutely everybody who has the benefit of a pension including those who are presently in their 20s, 30's and 40's. They will contribute sod all and then expect to be spoon fed by society whilst resenting their own self imposed misfortune.

The inheritance point is ridiculous, we will all be digging up daisies long before it comes into play and I would much prefer that my kids enjoy spending what's left of ours before the Government gets hold of it .... which it will in the accrued taxes from their expenditure over a period of time of course.