Current Affairs

[towny44]

I don't suppose the larger investment in America has anything to do with that country's larger population and, consequently larger potential customer base?

No-one in the exit camp has said life will be easy but I for one am increasingly fed up with undemocratic minority saying we're finished when, in reality, no-one knows how it's going to play out. Why not try giving it a chance, Jack?

The population of the U.S. is about seven times the U.K.
£240M X 7 = £1,680M compared to £8,200M, so not population size then.

Life is not easy once you have shot yourself in the foot. I am increasingly fed up with some who say democracy only happens on the one day of their choice.

It couldn't possibly have anything to do with the fact that Toyota have the 2 largest selling cars in the US selling over 750000 pa alone, compared with a total manufacture in the UK of about 150,000 with less than half that number sold in the UK?
Or that perhaps they are having to re-invest more heavily in the US to ensure that Trump does not apply punitive duties on their mexican plants.

[Silver_Shiney]

I think David Davis MP can explain better than me.....
“If a democracy cannot change its mind, it ceases to be a democracy”.

We're not talking about "changing its mind" we're talking about a large minority refusing to accept a democratic decision and wanting a re-run to get the answer THEY wanted.

But being a Tory he has of course gone back on that.
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/po ... 29636.html

... and politicians of other parties have never gone back on what they've said?

[Jack Staff]

I think David Davis MP can explain better than me.....
“If a democracy cannot change its mind, it ceases to be a democracy”.

We're not talking about "changing its mind" we're talking about a large minority refusing to accept a democratic decision and wanting a re-run to get the answer THEY wanted.

Yes, that's what democracy is.

But being a Tory he has of course gone back on that.
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/po ... 29636.html

... and politicians of other parties have never gone back on what they've said?

They all do, until they get the answer THEY want!

[Jack Staff]

I don't suppose the larger investment in America has anything to do with that country's larger population and, consequently larger potential customer base?

No-one in the exit camp has said life will be easy but I for one am increasingly fed up with undemocratic minority saying we're finished when, in reality, no-one knows how it's going to play out. Why not try giving it a chance, Jack?

The population of the U.S. is about seven times the U.K.
£240M X 7 = £1,680M compared to £8,200M, so not population size then.

Life is not easy once you have shot yourself in the foot. I am increasingly fed up with some who say democracy only happens on the one day of their choice.

It couldn't possibly have anything to do with the fact that Toyota have the 2 largest selling cars in the US selling over 750000 pa alone, compared with a total manufacture in the UK of about 150,000 with less than half that number sold in the UK?
Or that perhaps they are having to re-invest more heavily in the US to ensure that Trump does not apply punitive duties on their mexican plants.

Sorry, I can't get my head around what you are trying to say here. Apples and oranges spring to mind.

[Silver_Shiney]

We're not talking about "changing its mind" we're talking about a large minority refusing to accept a democratic decision and wanting a re-run to get the answer THEY wanted.

Yes, that's what democracy is.

It was quite clear that this was a once-for-all decision, not one that can be reversed in the future, like a general election, if you don't like the result.

... and politicians of other parties have never gone back on what they've said?

They all do, until they get the answer THEY want!

So why pick on the Conservatives?

[Silver_Shiney]

We're not talking about "changing its mind" we're talking about a large minority refusing to accept a democratic decision and wanting a re-run to get the answer THEY wanted.

Yes, that's what democracy is.

It was quite clear that this was a once-for-all decision, not one that can be reversed in the future, like a general election, if you don't like the result.

... and politicians of other parties have never gone back on what they've said?

They all do, until they get the answer THEY want!

So why pick on the Conservatives?

[towny44]

I don't suppose the larger investment in America has anything to do with that country's larger population and, consequently larger potential customer base?

No-one in the exit camp has said life will be easy but I for one am increasingly fed up with undemocratic minority saying we're finished when, in reality, no-one knows how it's going to play out. Why not try giving it a chance, Jack?

The population of the U.S. is about seven times the U.K.
£240M X 7 = £1,680M compared to £8,200M, so not population size then.

Life is not easy once you have shot yourself in the foot. I am increasingly fed up with some who say democracy only happens on the one day of their choice.

It couldn't possibly have anything to do with the fact that Toyota have the 2 largest selling cars in the US selling over 750000 pa alone, compared with a total manufacture in the UK of about 150,000 with less than half that number sold in the UK?
Or that perhaps they are having to re-invest more heavily in the US to ensure that Trump does not apply punitive duties on their mexican plants.

Sorry, I can't get my head around what you are trying to say here. Apples and oranges spring to mind.

I was trying to give you a couple of alternative scenarios as to why Toyota are investing far more in the US than in the UK, but I was forgetting that socialists don't have the capacity to accept rational thinking.

[Jack Staff]

We're not talking about "changing its mind" we're talking about a large minority refusing to accept a democratic decision and wanting a re-run to get the answer THEY wanted.

Yes, that's what democracy is.

It was quite clear that this was a once-for-all decision, not one that can be reversed in the future, like a general election, if you don't like the result.

A week is a long time in politics

... and politicians of other parties have never gone back on what they've said?

They all do, until they get the answer THEY want!

So why pick on the Conservatives?

NIC, triggering A50 on 24th June....how many do you want? The fact is they are in power at the moment and it matters. Labour, on the other hand, can say anything they want this week and change it next. That doesn't matter because no one is listening to them anyway.

[Jack Staff]

I was trying to give you a couple of alternative scenarios as to why Toyota are investing far more in the US than in the UK, but I was forgetting that socialists don't have the capacity to accept rational thinking.

Why do you think I'm a socialist? is it simply because anyone who doesn't agree with you is part of the leftist elite? Like Major and Heseltine perhaps?

[Silver_Shiney]

NIC, triggering A50 on 24th June....how many do you want? The fact is they are in power at the moment and it matters. Labour, on the other hand, can say anything they want this week and change it next. That doesn't matter because no one is listening to them anyway.

What's that supposed to mean?

[Jack Staff]

NIC, triggering A50 on 24th June....how many do you want? The fact is they are in power at the moment and it matters. Labour, on the other hand, can say anything they want this week and change it next. That doesn't matter because no one is listening to them anyway.

What's that supposed to mean?

The conservative budget climb down this week and Cameron stating he would trigger on 24th June, just a couple of examples.

[Silver_Shiney]

NIC, triggering A50 on 24th June....how many do you want? The fact is they are in power at the moment and it matters. Labour, on the other hand, can say anything they want this week and change it next. That doesn't matter because no one is listening to them anyway.

What's that supposed to mean?

The conservative budget climb down this week and Cameron stating he would trigger on 24th June, just a couple of examples.

What's your point? You agreed that other party's politicians change their minds - even when they're in power, so I don't think your argument holds water.

[Jack Staff]

NIC, triggering A50 on 24th June....how many do you want? The fact is they are in power at the moment and it matters. Labour, on the other hand, can say anything they want this week and change it next. That doesn't matter because no one is listening to them anyway.

What's that supposed to mean?

The conservative budget climb down this week and Cameron stating he would trigger on 24th June, just a couple of examples.

What's your point? You agreed that other party's politicians change their minds - even when they're in power, so I don't think your argument holds water.

My point is politicians are politicians!
I agree other party's politicians change their minds, but when they are in power it really does matter (including the manifesto that got them to power).
That is why I picked on Conservatives. I would quite happily pick on Labour (or anyone else for that matter) if they were in power, making as much of a mess.

[towny44]

[/quote]
What's your point? You agreed that other party's politicians change their minds - even when they're in power, so I don't think your argument holds water.
[/quote]
My point is politicians are politicians!
I agree other party's politicians change their minds, but when they are in power it really does matter (including the manifesto that got them to power).
That is why I picked on Conservatives. I would quite happily pick on Labour (or anyone else for that matter) if they were in power, making as much of a mess.
[/quote]
Jack, the mess is all in your mind, I think you should seek treatment for these delusions, as they seem to have taken over your life.

[Mervyn and Trish]

NIC, triggering A50 on 24th June....how many do you want? The fact is they are in power at the moment and it matters. Labour, on the other hand, can say anything they want this week and change it next. That doesn't matter because no one is listening to them anyway.

What's that supposed to mean?

The conservative budget climb down this week and Cameron stating he would trigger on 24th June, just a couple of examples.

And the biggest one of all. Gordon Brown. "No more boom and bust".

By the way in case you missed it Dave is no longer PM. Theresa May is and she always said end of March. And we're not there yet.

[Jack Staff]

NIC, triggering A50 on 24th June....how many do you want? The fact is they are in power at the moment and it matters. Labour, on the other hand, can say anything they want this week and change it next. That doesn't matter because no one is listening to them anyway.

What's that supposed to mean?

The conservative budget climb down this week and Cameron stating he would trigger on 24th June, just a couple of examples.

And the biggest one of all. Gordon Brown. "No more boom and bust".

By the way in case you missed it Dave is no longer PM. Theresa May is and she always said end of March. And we're not there yet.

Ah, Golden Brown the man that saved the world
I am well aware who the PM is at the moment. We were talking about Tory lies, one of which was to trigger A50 on 24th June.

[Silver_Shiney]

Jack, if the PM was irresponsible enough to ignore the democratic decision and allow a re-run, and that referendum also voted for Brexit by the same majority, would you be demanding a third vote?

[Mervyn and Trish]

And Jack should the Labour party ever win a General Election (an unlikely concept in the near future I know) by taking over a million more of the total vote than the other parties, will they dismiss that as "a few votes" and immediately call a new election to check the result?

And it was only you Jack talking about Tory lies. I was widening the conversation to include Labour lies. Is that not permitted?

[oldbluefox]

We were talking about Tory lies, one of which was to trigger A50 on 24th June.

The day after the Brexit vote? Really? It was Corbyn who insisted Article 50 should be invoked on June 24th. Some people make it up as they go along.
Personally I wish Article 50 had been invoked earlier. For me, the sooner we can enter negotiations the better.

[Mervyn and Trish]

On the current debate about Scottish independence I think Theresa May is talking sense and Mrs Krankie her usual nonsense.

Of course for Krankie and many other Scots they need no logic. They hate the English and Brexit is just the excuse for a rerun.

But it would be bonkers for the Scots to be asked to vote before the outcome of the Brexit negotiations is known. We might get a rubbish deal and they may want to consider a different future. But we might get a decent deal which they'd prefer to the uncertainty of going it alone.

It is even conceivable that along the way something will happen and we won't leave at all. In which case wouldn't Krankie look silly if she'd taken Scotland out of the UK and possibly out of the EU too unnecessarily?

And even if we get the worst possible deal and Scotland managed to stay in as an independent country, which is a long way from certain, how would the economics look?

Currently two thirds of Scotland's exports go to the rest of the UK. That's more than 4 times their trade with the rest of the EU. And more than 5 times their trade with the rest of the world. So are they better off with free trade with the UK or free trade with the EU? Because if we fail to get a decent deal with the EU they wouldn't be allowed to do their own deal with the rest of the UK.

Not that economics is Krankie's strong suit. Remember the SNP promised a prosperous future based on oil. Then the price collapsed. If they had won last time they'd be bust now. And of course out of the UK they would lose their subsidy from the hateful English.

The only argument for a quick vote would be that hatred which Krankie cannot voice. What she is afraid of is that if the vote is delayed we might get a decent EU deal and for all her bluster about respecting the will of the people she doesn't want to let them see the real choice.

Finally let's not forget Krankie represents less than 50% of the Scots population who are themselves less than 10% of the UK. So she represents less than 5%. That's a very small tail demanding to wave a very large dog.

[Silver_Shiney]

If Scotland gained independence, any application for EU membership must be agreed by all member states. If granted, the Basque and Catalonia regions would then demand independence. Do you think Spain would grant them that? Spain, for one, would not accept Scotland's application.

[Mervyn and Trish]

And one against is all they need

[oldbluefox]

Wow Mervyn!!!
Not bad for 9.00 on a Friday morning.
I agree!!

[Mervyn and Trish]

Let's not celebrate our agreement. Jack will be along with the facts shortly!

[towny44]

Wow Mervyn!!!
Not bad for 9.00 on a Friday morning.
I agree!!

Yes that post was well elucidated and I agree with everything he said.

There is one thing which does puzzle me though, with his very right wing views and his dislike of the liberal elite, how on earth did he ever get a job at the BBC?