Transport poverty

[Kendhni]

Another definition for 'poverty', I see.
Transport poverty

I can actually see the point but like many things the best way to save money is to plan a bit more, consider walking and don't do unnecessary journeys.
I would like to see the government make costs of travel and parking, in relation to work, tax deductable .. that would alleviate the problem for many.

[Silver_Shiney]

I agree it is a problem for many. As well as Ken's suggestions, the cost of public transport should be reduced, and made more reliable.

Unfortunately, it's a Catch-22 situation. Bristol is the most congested city in the country outside of London. The bus fare is expensive and (certainly on the route I use) the bus is invariably late, if indeed it runs at all. If the fares were more affordable, and the service could be relied on, more people would get out of their cars and use the bus. This would reduce the congestion and, with better occupancy, the routes would be more financially viable.

However, as the service cannot be trusted, and the fare does not represent value for money, more people (and, regrettably, I will be joining them soon) are turning to their cars, adding to the congestion problem and making the bus service less financially viable which, in turn, lessens the prospect of fairer fares.

[oldbluefox]

To be honest I think too many people have become reliant on the motor car when they don't really need it and moreover, can't really afford it. Getting my fiddle out....... when we were young we couldn't afford a car so it was a case of walk it or cycle it or don't go. This did not seem unusual to me.
My grandfather used to walk 5 miles to the mines, do a day's shift and walk home again across the fields, and then had a bath at home. My father used to cycle 10 miles on his 3 speed Raleigh to my grammar school for a parent's evening and woe betide me if it was raining and blowing a gale and my reports were less than impressive.
Understandably if you live a long way to work then the bicycle may not be an option. We talk about poverty in this country but I feel we have become accustomed to high standards of living from an early age and don't really appreciate what real poverty is.
One solution would indeed be to make public transport much cheaper and affordable. I am staggered how expensive it is and surely, if it were cheaper more people would use it thus avoiding half empty buses which must be uneconomical to run.

[Dark Knight]

What a load of absolute bollocks

"the lowest 10% of car owners" if they are that poor , how come they have a car at all.
as usual we are harping on about poverty in country that doesn't have any real poverty, coz the government pay up to readily
for real poverty look at China, India, Brazil etc etc etc
the UK is a free ride for lazy b******s and we all know it ,but are to scared to say so , for fear of being seen as uncaring and selfish
if they are that bloody poor sell the car and buy food and clothes

[oldbluefox]

Part of the problem is that many services are now being centralised so instead of going 'down the road' to see your doctor you now have to travel miles to one of these brand spanking new medical centres where you will find doctors' surgeries, dentists, physiotherapists, nurses clinics etc. Hospitals are now being seen as specialist centres so again you have to travel. Quite apart from successive governments spreading the load around the country, they have gone in the opposite direction and located business and commerce centrally rather than providing subsidies to take it away from already overcrowded cities. Poor infrastructure means that many businesses are reluctant to set up away from the cities. This is a Catch 22 situation - business doesn't come because there is no infrastructure and no infrastructure goes in because there is no business. Meanwhile there are areas of the country which are stagnating from lack of investment.

steps down from soapbox as he is going off topic although there is a link to over population, parking problems and congestion

[oldbluefox]

DK is right. If you are poor you can't afford a motor car, plasma TV, Sky television or an iPhone. Your priority should be food and shelter, especially for your children.

[Dark Knight]

Poverty is over used and is now seen as the catch all for anyone who spends more than they earn or is dossing about on benefits

if people were in real poverty, we would see homeless people everywhere, kids scouring rubbish dumps to collect plastic to sell, death and starvation would be common place
this is not a poor country, people are not in Fuel poverty, transport poverty or an other type of poverty, what the real issue is is greed and hypocrisy
people are greedy and want it all without lifting a finger to help themselves and the government is too scared to end this cycle.
It is high time we identified the real thiefs and scroungers and did something about the benefits culture and made working the only option unless people were GENUINELY too ill to work, stress and a bad back are just excuses for laziness

[Mervyn and Trish]

DK, I really wish you'd come off the fence and say what you really mean!

I know there are some people out there who have genuine problems making ends meet, but it irritated me beyond belief not so long ago to see a single mother on tv wondering how she was going to manage, the interview being conducted in front of a plasma tv with a screen size that wouldn't have looked out of place at the local Vue Cinema. Perhaps she should have thought of that before she was silly enough to get pregnant by some feckless youth who immediately disappeared rather than face his responsibilities - something the present benefits system makes all too easy.

Certainly times have changed since we were younger. At one time most people lived close to where they worked and walked or cycled there. Now we've become used to commuting to work and are paying the price.

Years ago I lived in Sheffield and the buses were subsidised by the local authority (it was a municipal service pre-privatisation) and were cheap, frequent and reliable. They therefore ran close to full and there were far fewer cars on the road. I had a car but wouldn't dream of using it for work. Then the government forced the council to cut the subsidy, fares rocketed, passenger numbers fell, the service deteriorated and traffic congestion rose. And because the buses were now running almost empty they ran at a loss, which the council had to pick up the bill, which was more than the previous subsidy.

[Dark Knight]

Merv

this is perhaps one of the few issues that I get het up about and it annoys me when people try to defend lazy, greedy selfish benefit sloths, who contribute nothing but expect a plasma telly, mobile phone, car etc etc
it is about time they were told that they are luxuries not a god given right

[noddy10]

As you get on some cruises the I am "alright jack" people that are perhaps on there 3rd or 4th cruise of the year never been unemployed and siting on there high moral ground.

[Kendhni]

Quite possibly too many people have lost a grasp on reality, what is important, how to prioritise and how to budget properly.

[Dark Knight]

Noddy
it's not I'm alright jack ,it is hard working decent people, who are pissed off with the lazy benefit thiefs who do nothing and contribute nothing ,yet expect to be kept in the lap of luxury

if you feel so strongly, then donate all the money you spend on luxuries, to charity and watch some baby making machine live a better life style than you. Still keen are you ??
it's always the same when the bleeding hearts start about poverty, there is no real poverty in this country, all there is is greed , selfishness and laziness

[Silver_Shiney]

Noddy
it's not I'm alright jack ,it is hard working decent people, who are p***ed off with the lazy benefit thiefs who do nothing and contribute nothing ,yet expect to be kept in the lap of luxury

if you feel so strongly, then donate all the money you spend on luxuries, to charity and watch some baby making machine live a better life style than you. Still keen are you ??
it's always the same when the bleeding hearts start about poverty, there is no real poverty in this country, all there is is greed , selfishness and laziness

DK, I think Noddy was using the royal "you", not speaking to you directly. If you read it in that context, you'll see he is in full agreement with you, as indeed, I am.

Regards

[Dark Knight]

OOPS !!! sorry if I mis read your post Ndddy

[noddy10]

Dark Knight you are talking total codswallop and you have been brainwashed to believe that everyone on benefits are " lazy benefit thiefs who do nothing and contribute nothing ,yet expect to be kept in the lap of luxury" your exact words when unfortunately are genuine hard working people who cannot get reemployed after redundancy. For an example my wife and I have both worked hard, long shifts myself in the Fire Service for 34 yrs before retirement and my wife who has recently lost her job after working for the same council for 35 yrs in Social Care without a thank you or a penny in redundancy. Because we have both worked hard and luckily have more than £16000 in savings cannot claim any benefit. So at a stroke she lost a job of over £40000 after years of dedicated loyalty and is finding it very hard to find another job and is not a "lazy benefit thiefs who do nothing and contribute nothing ,yet expect to be kept in the lap of luxury".

[Silver_Shiney]

Noddy, with respect, I think this time you have misread DK. He is clearly railing against the many real "benefits fraudsters", not decent people like you and your good lady who have been overtaken by events.

I hope it works out for you and Mrs Noddy.

[Dark Knight]

Noddy
you are entitled to your opinion but i stand firmly behind my view that there are many , many people who claim benefits and cry poverty, when they should be working and contributing to society.

It appears i have not mis-read you after all, and you current position hardly puts you in the poor house

[oldbluefox]

Noddy, I believe Silver Shiney is right. There is something wrong in this country that allows benefit cheats to adopt benefit as a lifestyle whilst those who are in genuine need, who have worked and been careful with their money (saving for a rainy day) suddenly find they get very little support when they need it.
My brother has just had a minor operation and has been 'on the sick' for the past three weeks. Because he has worked all his life, paid his dues and has (albeit limited) savings he can claim very little. Meanwhile there are those who have no intention of working who can make a very comfortable living by exploiting the various benefits that are available to them. It is the latter who annoy me.
Similarly I hope the situation for you and your good lady improves.

[oldbluefox]

DK, I think the benefit system should be there to support those who are out of work for a period until they find new work, as in Mr Mrs Noddy's case. It should not be used as a lifestyle choice as in the cases you mention.

[Dark Knight]

How can people claim poverty , when is it blindingly obvious they are not poor??
and moaning that you only have 16K in the bank , just proves my point, that is not poverty, it is nowhere near poverty
India and china etc are poverty and bemoaning the fact you get no help coz you only have 16k in the bank is preposterous and does the poster no favours what so ever

If you had no money , couldn't afford food and clothes, had no home, then yes you deserve help but going on cruises with plenty of the cash in the bank and moaning just shows how far we have sunk

perhaps Noddy should cut his coat according to his cloth, 16K is more than many people earn in a year, so I fail to see what he has to moan about?
or is just that you cannot afford the luxuries you have take for granted when you both worked? which is still not poverty

[oldbluefox]

I don't think Noddy was claiming poverty. You are right when you compare our interpretation of poverty in this country to that of other countries. However there is an iniquitous imbalance in this country where we allow some to claim benefits, who have never paid a penny into the system, whereas others who have worked and paid their taxes can claim little or nothing. I often wonder if it's better to spend all your money, live the high life and then rely on the state to support if times get rough. I'm not so sure that morally I can justify it.

[Dark Knight]

My point iss till that there is no such thing as real dirt poor poverty in this country, coz the governament bail out all the lazy wastrels everytime
transport poverty is total claptrap, coz to be in Transport poverty you have to own a car, bull, if you can afford a car you are not poor
The benefits system is morally flawed and should not be used to give scroungers and scum a free ride, it should be used as a saftey net for people who genuinekly need it and Noddy doesn't need it.

[Manoverboard]

Real transport poverty ...

* Main City High Street scene Mumbai style

* There is a cow tetherred to a railing at the roadside

* An elderly lady sits at the edge of the road selling bunches of grass

* A gent in a suit gives the lady a few rupees for a bunch of grass to save her from starving

* The gent gives the grass to the cow to save it from starving

* The cow has a cr*p, along comes an old man with a cart and a shovel

* He sells the manure to the family who are growing the grass.

Poverty in this Country .... yeah right.

[Dark Knight]

my point exactly

[noddy10]

Dark Knight I think you should read posts correctly before you get on your high horse not once in my post was I complaining poverty only saying we were very lucky to have £16000 in savings. Therefore even if we tried, by the way the wife did not try to claim benefits, we knew of the £16000 cut off point. My reaction was to your awful arrogant attitude which you stated that "lazy benefit thiefs who do nothing and contribute nothing ,yet expect to be kept in the lap of luxury" which who have through no fault of there own find themselves jobless and not as lucky as what we are having £16000 in savings find themselves in. To classify everybody of which many are jobless and dont want to be and trying desperate to find work but according to you are "lazy benefit thiefs who do nothing and contribute nothing ,yet expect to be kept in the lap of luxury". That is an awful and shameful attitude to have against everybody on benefits. One of the major faults of the P&O forum was the trouble caused by a certain persons attitude, comments and posts it now seems that after the honeymoom period of this great forum the same is rearing its ugly head on here or perhaps you might be that same person in disguise.