Brexit

[oldbluefox]

........and exaggerated then they wonder why we don't believe them although some hang on their every word.

[screwy]

I see Top Hat Ted now see's himself as a news reporter, thrusting his Mobile into the faces of Ministers.Personally i'd tell him to get his face out of my personal space.

[Gill W]

Wouldn't it have been beneficial if the BBC explained to the viewer how and why it could make any difference.
They made a statement in their story with nothing backed up by fact.

'a danger to viability' from cheaper imports while exports will be hit with tariffs.
What level of fuel is imported and exported.
I thought we bought crude and refined it for the domestic market.

Sounds a load of old cobblers to me

I didn’t see this and don’t know what was said.

If it wasn’t adequately explained and they’d said more, you’d have dismissed it anyway.

Either way, the end result would have been the same.

You’d be posting that it was a load of old cobblers

[Gill W]

Some wild misreporting of the Johnson / Merkel meeting.

Merkel actually said that an alternative to the backstop might need to be found in 30 days rather than 2 years, and she looked forward to hearing the UK's suggestions.

Johnson, floundering and completely out of his depth, misunderstood and thought she'd issued a challenge for him to find a solution in 30 days, accepted the challenge, and agreed that it's up to the UK to find a solution (well, I agree with him on the last point)

The U.K. Media reports bear no resemblance to what actually has happened.

[barney]

Says you.

As you know, I'm no Johnson fan, but I thought it was a masterly performance when compared to the previous PM.

We all know the UK cannot come up with any solution that the EU will agree to because they will reject everything proposed.

They are still holding out hope that the UK will remain.

Why they think that the three times rejected WA will pass on a fourth vote is beyond me.
They are now forcing the no deal.
They will have to erect a hard border if they choose to do so (I'd guess not)

It's like a wife beater saying that I didn't want to hit you but you made me do it.

Pathetic in my book.

We leave on the 31st October and put an end to this whole sorry mess (or don't and it rumbles on )

[towny44]

The main problem with the Irish backstop is that it only puts the onus on the UK to make compromises in the trade negotiations in order to avoid it being implemented, and of course then we can only exit the backstop with the agreement of the EU.
This merely confirms that the EU always has to have the upper hand in any negotiation, and unfortunately over the last decades the strength and size of the EU single market has enabled them to fully utilise this strength in most of their trade deals.
Since both parties have indicated their desire not to have a hard border in Ireland one can only assume that the EU do not trust the UK to live up to this aim, when I was working as a buyer this attitude would have undermined any negotiation and lead to the other party walking away from the them. Which is what TM should have done in Sept/Oct last year, leaving us with time for the EU to reconsider their iniquitous demand, and then maybe we would have already left the EU.

[barney]

Teresa May's team agreed to the terms of the WA without getting approval from MPs.
That was the fatal error because the EU side thought that they had concluded a deal.
The European Parliament is there simply to talk but then ratify whatever the Commission come up with.
The UK Parliament has more teeth.

The proposal has been rejected by Parliament three times.
So, it is a dead deal.
At some stage the European leaders have to come to terms with the fact that things have changed.

[Mervyn and Trish]

I keep coming back to the one simple fact that they keep banging on about the backstop being essential to prevent a hard border in Ireland when that very insistence makes no deal and a consequent hard border inevitable. Yet if they drop the backstop and then negotiate a trade deal in good faith it would never be needed anyway.

[Manoverboard]

Some wild misreporting of the Johnson / Merkel meeting.

Merkel actually said that an alternative to the backstop might need to be found in 30 days rather than 2 years, and she looked forward to hearing the UK's suggestions.

Johnson, floundering and completely out of his depth, misunderstood and thought she'd issued a challenge for him to find a solution in 30 days, accepted the challenge, and agreed that it's up to the UK to find a solution (well, I agree with him on the last point)

The U.K. Media reports bear no resemblance to what actually has happened.

It's a jolly good job that you were there to be able to correct everybody ….

[barney]

Absolutely Merv.
Quite bizarre isn't it.
Plus they will get their 39 billion bribe money as well.
I can easily find footage of Mr Juncker saying nothing is agreed until everything is agreed.

[barney]

Some wild misreporting of the Johnson / Merkel meeting.

Merkel actually said that an alternative to the backstop might need to be found in 30 days rather than 2 years, and she looked forward to hearing the UK's suggestions.

Johnson, floundering and completely out of his depth, misunderstood and thought she'd issued a challenge for him to find a solution in 30 days, accepted the challenge, and agreed that it's up to the UK to find a solution (well, I agree with him on the last point)

The U.K. Media reports bear no resemblance to what actually has happened.

It's a jolly good job that you were there to be able to correct everybody ….

It's a funny old world when a self confessed Tory voter criticises a Tory PM and I as a Labour voter thinks he did an OK job.

[towny44]

I keep coming back to the one simple fact that they keep banging on about the backstop being essential to prevent a hard border in Ireland when that very insistence makes no deal and a consequent hard border inevitable. Yet if they drop the backstop and then negotiate a trade deal in good faith it would never be needed anyway.

I totally agree Merv, which leads me to assume that the MAIN reason for the backstop is to put pressure on the UK to agree to a less than acceptable trade deal in order to avoid it being implemented.
I hope Boris holds his nerve because I really don't believe the EU want a no deal, and the worry that the UK will want retribution with possible low tax incentives to encourage inward investment.

[barney]

The Guardian reported yesterday that in the year to date, over £54 billion of external investment has come in to the Fintech sector.
Despite Brexit (I added that bit)
The UK economy is looking quite healthy.

[Gill W]

Some wild misreporting of the Johnson / Merkel meeting.

Merkel actually said that an alternative to the backstop might need to be found in 30 days rather than 2 years, and she looked forward to hearing the UK's suggestions.

Johnson, floundering and completely out of his depth, misunderstood and thought she'd issued a challenge for him to find a solution in 30 days, accepted the challenge, and agreed that it's up to the UK to find a solution (well, I agree with him on the last point)

The U.K. Media reports bear no resemblance to what actually has happened.

It's a jolly good job that you were there to be able to correct everybody ….

It's a funny old world when a self confessed Tory voter criticises a Tory PM and I as a Labour voter thinks he did an OK job.

As you know (because I have told you before) I voted for the Conservative candidate last time, on the basis he was active in the local community. if it wasn't for that, I wouldn't have voted for anybody at the last election.

I find it bizarre that you would think this would preclude me from criticising the PM if I think he's doing a bad job.

I'm not a party political person - I vote for who I feel will best respresent me. I've voted Labour in the past, and I may do again. I may also vote Lib Dem or Green. I will decide at the next election.

You claim to be a leftie, but you are on the same side as the far right when it comes to Brexit.

It is indeed a funny old world.

I would like to think that you are joking about Johnson doing an ok job during his meeting with Merkel. But I know you aren't.

[Gill W]

Some wild misreporting of the Johnson / Merkel meeting.

Merkel actually said that an alternative to the backstop might need to be found in 30 days rather than 2 years, and she looked forward to hearing the UK's suggestions.

Johnson, floundering and completely out of his depth, misunderstood and thought she'd issued a challenge for him to find a solution in 30 days, accepted the challenge, and agreed that it's up to the UK to find a solution (well, I agree with him on the last point)

The U.K. Media reports bear no resemblance to what actually has happened.

It's a jolly good job that you were there to be able to correct everybody ….

If my posts bore you, you know what to do

[barney]

It's a jolly good job that you were there to be able to correct everybody ….

It's a funny old world when a self confessed Tory voter criticises a Tory PM and I as a Labour voter thinks he did an OK job.

As you know (because I have told you before) I voted for the Conservative candidate last time, on the basis he was active in the local community. if it wasn't for that, I wouldn't have voted for anybody at the last election.

I find it bizarre that you would think this would preclude me from criticising the PM if I think he's doing a bad job.

I'm not a party political person - I vote for who I feel will best respresent me. I've voted Labour in the past, and I may do again. I may also vote Lib Dem or Green. I will decide at the next election.

You claim to be a leftie, but you are on the same side as the far right when it comes to Brexit.

It is indeed a funny old world.

I would like to think that you are joking about Johnson doing an ok job during his meeting with Merkel. But I know you aren't.

You clearly think that Brexit is the domain of the far right.
Is Corbyn far right?
Is Len Mclusky far right.
Are virtually every every trade union in the UK far right?
Am I far right?
Are literally millions of Labour voters far right?

Square that circle?

[Manoverboard]

Some wild misreporting of the Johnson / Merkel meeting.

Merkel actually said that an alternative to the backstop might need to be found in 30 days rather than 2 years, and she looked forward to hearing the UK's suggestions.

Johnson, floundering and completely out of his depth, misunderstood and thought she'd issued a challenge for him to find a solution in 30 days, accepted the challenge, and agreed that it's up to the UK to find a solution (well, I agree with him on the last point)

The U.K. Media reports bear no resemblance to what actually has happened.

It's a jolly good job that you were there to be able to correct everybody ….

If my posts bore you, you know what to do

Your posts don't bore me per se but I do find it a tad pathetic that whenever there is even a sniff of a hint of any positive news for Brexit you cannot resist stepping in to attempt to discredit or revise that snippet of news to suit your own preferences. An alternative viewpoint is of course fine but trying to re-write the facts is … well … boring.

My take was that Boris seemed ( as seen on live TV ) to make personal progress with his German counterpart, that they displayed a mutual respect and that Boris has been awarded a green flag to attempt to come up with a solution that the Germans can support …. rather than a simple " p*ss off Herr Bojo ".

[screwy]

And most political commentators agreed that Boris came across well and did a good job,very difficult when your trying to deal with people who just turn their backs.

[Ray Scully]

My take was that Boris seemed ( as seen on live TV ) to make personal progress with his German counterpart, that they displayed a mutual respect and that Boris has been awarded a green flag to attempt to come up with a solution that the Germans can support …. rather than a simple " p*ss off Herr Bojo ".

Well that what I heard reported, a good chemistry evident between the two, Boris getting his feet under the table. Then a pic which blows it all away

boris table.jpg.gallery.jpg

Oh dear

[Manoverboard]

It is surely obvious Ray that Boris was discussing ' a load of old cobblers ' with one of the cobblers and that the question of re-soles arose when their conversation switched to the Rissoles on the Lunch Menu.

Seemples

[barney]

My take was that Boris seemed ( as seen on live TV ) to make personal progress with his German counterpart, that they displayed a mutual respect and that Boris has been awarded a green flag to attempt to come up with a solution that the Germans can support …. rather than a simple " p*ss off Herr Bojo ".

Well that what I heard reported, a good chemistry evident between the two, Boris getting his feet under the table. Then a pic which blows it all away boris table.jpg.gallery.jpg
Oh dear

Once again you've fallen for it!

Watch the video of that moment and you'll see that is not what happened.

He was laughing at a Macron joke and momentarily moved his foot up.

That exact moment, his foot was on the table, which it was for a micro second.

I can't believe that I'm defending a Tory PM, but the quislings and collaborators are doing literally everything possible to try and undermine the UK.

I can't actually believe what is happening to this country.

It's really quite saddening that so many simply refuse to accept a democratic vote and will go to any lengths to scupper it.

[Ray Scully]

My take was that Boris seemed ( as seen on live TV ) to make personal progress with his German counterpart, that they displayed a mutual respect and that Boris has been awarded a green flag to attempt to come up with a solution that the Germans can support …. rather than a simple " p*ss off Herr Bojo ".

Well that what I heard reported, a good chemistry evident between the two, Boris getting his feet under the table. Then a pic which blows it all away boris table.jpg.gallery.jpg
Oh dear

Once again you've fallen for it! Fallen for what? don't shoot the messenger that is the pic that is circulating around many news outlets. Perhaps you should be talking with them

Watch the video of that moment and you'll see that is not what happened.

He was laughing at a Macron joke and momentarily moved his foot up.

That exact moment, his foot was on the table, which it was for a micro second.

I can't believe that I'm defending a Tory PM, but the quislings and collaborators are doing literally everything possible to try and undermine the UK.

I can't actually believe what is happening to this country.

It's really quite saddening that so many simply refuse to accept a democratic vote and will go to any lengths to scupper it.

Perhaps this goes some way to explaining it Barney

68862289_2401721590150605_2565475255430676480_n.jpg

[Gill W]

It's a jolly good job that you were there to be able to correct everybody ….

If my posts bore you, you know what to do

Your posts don't bore me per se but I do find it a tad pathetic that whenever there is even a sniff of a hint of any positive news for Brexit you cannot resist stepping in to attempt to discredit or revise that snippet of news to suit your own preferences. An alternative viewpoint is of course fine but trying to re-write the facts is … well … boring.

My take was that Boris seemed ( as seen on live TV ) to make personal progress with his German counterpart, that they displayed a mutual respect and that Boris has been awarded a green flag to attempt to come up with a solution that the Germans can support …. rather than a simple " p*ss off Herr Bojo ".

Whereas I find it pathetic that you ( that’s a collective you) twist everything to suit your narrative.

Nothing much has changed after these meetings.

As I’ve been saying for weeks ( and shouted down by the usual suspects) Johnson’s hosts treated him with curtesy and have indicated that they are willing to listen to any new suggestions he might have regarding the backstop.

However, now that it suits you, you’ve decided that it’s progress and have forgotten /ignored (latter more likely) what I’ve been saying.

What did change is that Johnson actually said it is up to U.K. to find new solutions ( yes he did) and he erroneously thought that Merkel was setting him some sort of 30 day challenge to do this.

So now we wait for him to meet the challenge he set up for himself.

A new solution by 21st September.

[barney]

Why hasn't Brexit happened ?

Not rhetorical, but actually ?

It hasn't happened because the losing side have 100% refused to accept the result and get behind getting the best possible outcome for the UK.
It's as simple as that really.

The blame for the current situation lies firmly with the MPs in Parliament, many of whom will be looking for new jobs shortly, on both sides of the house. They could have easily voted through May's deal but chose not to. So, we are where we are.

The people were asked.
They gave their decision.
Parliament have failed to act upon it.

This has led to the demise of two Tory PMs and very soon, one Labour leader.

Parliament of the future will have a very different makeup to the current one.

[Gill W]

And most political commentators agreed that Boris came across well and did a good job,very difficult when your trying to deal with people who just turn their backs.

Only the ones you want to believe said that. Get yourself out of you echo chamber and you’ll find other commentators saying different things