Brexit

[oldbluefox]

2016.jpg

Interesting stats if true.

[towny44]

I predicted it here months ago.

Is it you then that writes Laura's scripts?

[david63]

Did anyone else have the misfortune to watch Question Time last night? Total disgrace!

Well at least we now all know what Labour's Brexit policy is (according to Emily Thornberry):

The no Brexit bill has to be passed.
We have a General Election that Labour will win.
Labour will re-negotiate the WA, basically leaving us in the EU without a say.
The "new" WA will be put to the people in another referendum.
Labour will campaign in the second referendum to REMAIN!!!

Also could somebody tell Ian Blackford that Scotland did not vote to remain (there was no Scottish vote) but the UK voted to leave.

[Mervyn and Trish]

Here's an idea. Let Scotland have independence. Then remove their votes from the referendum. Then the majority for leave will be bigger!

More seriously I did hear Mrs Krankie saying she wasn't prepared to see a future forced on Scotland by the rest of the UK.

She is apparently prepared to see a future forced on the rest of the UK by the 1.6m who voted to stay in Scotland.

[screwy]

Miller & Major,remember him,the man of integrity? Have lost their legal challenge in the High Court,going to appeal at the Supreme Court.

[Mervyn and Trish]

And then the European Court no doubt!

Major and Blair are yesterday's men and among the architects of where we find ourselves. They should both learn to keep their mouths shut.

And Miller is not even yesterday's woman. Her vote and voice is no more relevant than mine. Or anybody else's, whichever side they voted for.

[oldbluefox]

Is this the same Major who committed us to the Maastricht Treaty giving more power to the EU as opposed to a Common Market (which is what I did vote for)?

[Mervyn and Trish]

Yes surprise surprise.

And the same Major who prorogued parliament in 1997 to avoid debate of the Parliamentary Commissioner's report on the cash-for-questions affair.

Pot-kettle-black anyone?

[david63]

I think I am loosing the will to live!

So now the "opposition" parties coalition are saying that they will not support a GE, not because Labour fear loosing the election but because they want to ensure that we do not leave on a no deal.

Bojo has stated that he is not, at the moment, going to resign if we do not leave on the 31st October.

So we end up with a situation where the Conservatives are the Government but have no majority so cannot pass any legislation. Labour et al are of the opinion that they have the "upper hand" but don't know what to do with it. We appear to be having a law that states that the PM (whoever that may be at the time) has to ask for an extension to Article 50 but there is no plan B if the EU say no to the extension. The length of the extension, if granted, is at the EU's discretion. The EU say that they are not going to re-negotiate the WA. Which would leave us with an extension of x days/weeks/month/years (delete as appropriate) still arguing about the same old same. Have I missed anything?

On a slightly different note over the last few months I have heard interviews with three senior Labour Party members (Jack Straw, Alan Johnson and Lord Falconer) who have all said that Jeremy Corbyn (and by definition Labour) are unelectable. Now I don't suppose those views will have permeated down the Opposition Front Bench by any chance?

All of this means that we have an unelectable Labour leader running scared of having an election who is trying to run the country via the back door and all the time strengthening the hands of Bojo and Nige.

My solution - kick the lot of them out (along with their £80k a year salaries and get some "normal" people in who have some common sense and can make a decision. They do nor appear to understand the country is fed up to the back teeth with all of this stupid posturing for perceived political gain.

[Stephen]

I think I am loosing the will to live!

So now the "opposition" parties coalition are saying that they will not support a GE, not because Labour fear loosing the election but because they want to ensure that we do not leave on a no deal.

Bojo has stated that he is not, at the moment, going to resign if we do not leave on the 31st October.

So we end up with a situation where the Conservatives are the Government but have no majority so cannot pass any legislation. Labour et al are of the opinion that they have the "upper hand" but don't know what to do with it. We appear to be having a law that states that the PM (whoever that may be at the time) has to ask for an extension to Article 50 but there is no plan B if the EU say no to the extension. The length of the extension, if granted, is at the EU's discretion. The EU say that they are not going to re-negotiate the WA. Which would leave us with an extension of x days/weeks/month/years (delete as appropriate) still arguing about the same old same. Have I missed anything?

On a slightly different note over the last few months I have heard interviews with three senior Labour Party members (Jack Straw, Alan Johnson and Lord Falconer) who have all said that Jeremy Corbyn (and by definition Labour) are unelectable. Now I don't suppose those views will have permeated down the Opposition Front Bench by any chance?

All of this means that we have an unelectable Labour leader running scared of having an election who is trying to run the country via the back door and all the time strengthening the hands of Bojo and Nige.

My solution - kick the lot of them out (along with their £80k a year salaries and get some "normal" people in who have some common sense and can make a decision. They do nor appear to understand the country is fed up to the back teeth with all of this stupid posturing for perceived political gain.

My thought too David

You couldn't make it up could you. The rest of the would must be rolling around laughing they're socks off.

[Manoverboard]

My solution - kick the lot of them out (along with their £80k a year salaries and get some "normal" people in who have some common sense and can make a decision.

Virtually all of the coalition Remoaner MPs are striving to stay in the EU because they are incapable of making decisions, it is so much easier for them to sit back and let the EU dictate what we will and will not do.

[Mervyn and Trish]

Some people say this episode has destroyed faith in politicians. My view is rather more chicken and egg.

I believe there are two reasons for the Brexit vote. One people were fed up with the EU. But probably more people were fed up with our own politicians not listening to us, nut standing up to the EU (as some countries do all the time) and then blaming the EU for the results.

Our politics have become too adversarial and too divorced from the real world as the present shambles demonstrates. So when this is all over (I estimate, by the way, that Brexit will happen just after HS2 is completed) we need a major review of our system.

We should forget restoring the Houses of Parliament as a seat of government. The arrangement of benches face to face encourages the stupid braying and insult hurling we see from all sides. We should restore it and re-open it as a very lucrative tourist attraction, a fine old but outdated building. Instead we should build a modern chamber more like the EU, the Scottish Parliament etc where representatives sit in a semicircle. I would say not in London, but that's probably not practicable given where Whitehall is!

No-one should be allowed to be an MP until they have a minimum of ten years experience is a real job. Parliaments should be firmly fixed at 4 years and no one should be allowed to sit as an MP for more than 2 terms. The only exception should be an MP elected between GEs at a by-election, who would be permitted to serve the remainder of the current term and then 2 more. Being an MP should be a full time, 9-5 job, with no outside jobs allowed. They should be paid a reasonable salary and be provided with London accommodation ( a modest furnished apartment, up to three bedrooms dependent on their family), in a purpose built block with security close to the house, lunch when on duty, a parliamentary office and PA, a bus/tube pass and second class rail travel home to their constituencies. No other expenses. After serving their terms they should return to the real world with their pension paid under the same rules and at the same age as the rest of us.

The Speaker should not be a political appointment nor an MP. The role should be taken by a senior civil servant as a truly impartial chairperson, appointed by a formal non-political process. That chairperson should be empowered to keep decent order to a strict rulebook and any MP infringing the rules by being rude, rowdy etc should be suspended for a month on first offence, sacked on second.

Constituencies should be reduced to 400 and equalised in population. The Commons should continue to be first past the post. The Lords should be abolished and replaced by an upper chamber elected by proportional representation in the intervals between the lower chamber.

The Prime Minister should in the first instance be elected as now, but in the case of a mid-term resignation, death etc, the ruling party should be allowed to put up 2 candidates, with one then chosen by a vote of the whole country.

Ex PMs should be prohibited from playing any further part in public life.

[towny44]

I blame the Dutch, if it hadn't been for William 1 of Orange beating James 11 at the battle of the Boyne, we might already have a united Ireland and no need for a backstop.

[Manoverboard]

…. Instead we should build a modern chamber more like the EU, the Scottish Parliament etc where representatives sit in a semicircle.

Right …. so then they can go round 'n' round in circles and back 'n' forth without actually agreeing anything.

No thanks, ditto proportional representation for the same reason.

[gilly88]

Some people say this episode has destroyed faith in politicians. My view is rather more chicken and egg.

I believe there are two reasons for the Brexit vote. One people were fed up with the EU. But probably more people were fed up with our own politicians not listening to us, nut standing up to the EU (as some countries do all the time) and then blaming the EU for the results.

Our politics have become too adversarial and too divorced from the real world as the present shambles demonstrates. So when this is all over (I estimate, by the way, that Brexit will happen just after HS2 is completed) we need a major review of our system.

We should forget restoring the Houses of Parliament as a seat of government. The arrangement of benches face to face encourages the stupid braying and insult hurling we see from all sides. We should restore it and re-open it as a very lucrative tourist attraction, a fine old but outdated building. Instead we should build a modern chamber more like the EU, the Scottish Parliament etc where representatives sit in a semicircle. I would say not in London, but that's probably not practicable given where Whitehall is!

No-one should be allowed to be an MP until they have a minimum of ten years experience is a real job. Parliaments should be firmly fixed at 4 years and no one should be allowed to sit as an MP for more than 2 terms. The only exception should be an MP elected between GEs at a by-election, who would be permitted to serve the remainder of the current term and then 2 more. Being an MP should be a full time, 9-5 job, with no outside jobs allowed. They should be paid a reasonable salary and be provided with London accommodation ( a modest furnished apartment, up to three bedrooms dependent on their family), in a purpose built block with security close to the house, lunch when on duty, a parliamentary office and PA, a bus/tube pass and second class rail travel home to their constituencies. No other expenses. After serving their terms they should return to the real world with their pension paid under the same rules and at the same age as the rest of us.

The Speaker should not be a political appointment nor an MP. The role should be taken by a senior civil servant as a truly impartial chairperson, appointed by a formal non-political process. That chairperson should be empowered to keep decent order to a strict rulebook and any MP infringing the rules by being rude, rowdy etc should be suspended for a month on first offence, sacked on second.

Constituencies should be reduced to 400 and equalised in population. The Commons should continue to be first past the post. The Lords should be abolished and replaced by an upper chamber elected by proportional representation in the intervals between the lower chamber.

The Prime Minister should in the first instance be elected as now, but in the case of a mid-term resignation, death etc, the ruling party should be allowed to put up 2 candidates, with one then chosen by a vote of the whole country.

Ex PMs should be prohibited from playing any further part in public life.

goodness this is too sensible by far I agree with everything you have written but the powers that be will never vote for it. they know where their breads buttered. mores the pity.

[david63]

They should be paid a reasonable salary

Therein lies a problem.

The other day I was reading on my GP's website that last year the average salary for the GPs was just under £50k and MPs are paid around £80k. So there is a serious imbalance there. Then we have footballers being paid hundreds of thousands of pounds a week.

Let's be honest there are many MPs who will shortly find out that they will struggle to get a job paying half their current salary.

I would say:

GPs - hundreds of thousands.
Footballers £80k (it is paid for by the fans)
MPs - £50k

[gfwgfw]

It will be alright on the night

[Mervyn and Trish]

They should be paid a reasonable salary

Therein lies a problem.

The other day I was reading on my GP's website that last year the average salary for the GPs was just under £50k and MPs are paid around £80k. So there is a serious imbalance there. Then we have footballers being paid hundreds of thousands of pounds a week.

Let's be honest there are many MPs who will shortly find out that they will struggle to get a job paying half their current salary.

I would say:

GPs - hundreds of thousands.
Footballers £80k (it is paid for by the fans)
MPs - £50k

That's a bit much for footballers working 90 minutes a week and that only from August to May!

[david63]

That's a bit much for footballers working 90 minutes a week and that only from August to May!

But, arguably, they do provide more entertainment

[Mervyn and Trish]

Oh I'm not so sure. My GP is very funny!

Actually I do think MPs, with the limits I suggested on expenses, and second jobs banned, should get about what they do today. I'd hate to go back to when only rich people could afford to do it. Especially as my proposal would stop it being a long term career. Not that being PM is that at the moment by the look of it!

[oldbluefox]

There should be trust in our politicians.

[towny44]

They should be paid a reasonable salary

Therein lies a problem.

The other day I was reading on my GP's website that last year the average salary for the GPs was just under £50k and MPs are paid around £80k. So there is a serious imbalance there. Then we have footballers being paid hundreds of thousands of pounds a week.

Let's be honest there are many MPs who will shortly find out that they will struggle to get a job paying half their current salary.

I would say:

GPs - hundreds of thousands.
Footballers £80k (it is paid for by the fans)
MPs - £50k

That's a bit much for footballers working 90 minutes a week and that only from August to May!

From my knowledge of what Pauline's cousin earns as a GP, they are already earning hundreds of thousands.

[oldbluefox]

Interesting point made on Any Answers today. Whilst Remainers are saying that those who voted to leave did not know what they were voting for, likewise those who voted to Remain do not know where remaining in the EU is going to take us. From what I have heard about the direction the EU is going it is not something I am happy with.
For how much longer is Parliament going to stall our leaving the EU thereby creating uncertainty and expense for those businesses importing and exporting goods to the EU and racking up expenses whilst the issue is dragging on. Had we left three years ago the worst of the disruption would be past us by now.
Give us a General Election and let the electorate decide. I tend to believe they know the likely outcome if they go to the country so they will delay for as long as they can simply to save their own skins.
As for the Tory rebels I believe they all knew it was likely they would not be reselected, would likely lose their seats or were retiring anyway so they were happy to vote against the government and had nothing to lose.

[screwy]

I for one will be happy not to see Grieve and Hammond again.

[Mervyn and Trish]

I'd be happy to see none of the bu**ers again
New election. Previous candidates need not reapply