Current Affairs

[towny44]

That's an exaggeration. I commented that if a cold climate was a factor, then it might be expected that countries with a colder climate than us, might be expected to be in a worse situation than us. That's hardly 'attempting to discredit the scientists'.
I can't think of any country further north than us with such a tightly packed population, and its still bloomin cold even in July up north, which might account for why the hotspots are up here.
Also, that's a massive leap to come to the conclusion that I 'think it's all Johnson's fault'.

There are no doubt many reasons why we are where we are, and the government, lead by Johnson, is accountable for their actions regarding Covid19. But that's not saying that he's personally at fault for everything.

[Manoverboard]

A Genetic study into the wider issues of slavery during the Colonial era ....

[Mervyn and Trish]

The difference is my amateur analysis didn't attempt to discredit the scientists.

That's an exaggeration. I commented that if a cold climate was a factor, then it might be expected that countries with a colder climate than us, might be expected to be in a worse situation than us. That's hardly 'attempting to discredit the scientists'.

You may not have intended it but to me the phrase "if iit was a factor" suggested you were not accepting the scientists view that temperature IS a factor. There are of course others too. Including population density, level of international travel, obesity, age and now I see wealth as well.

[Manoverboard]

Things could have been done differently accepts one's PM

[Onelife]

Thank gawd...I was starting to think I was.... Btw... Glad to hear you all had an enjoyable day out… and it goes without saying the day out will have been made more pleasurable by having you onboard

To even suggest that our day has been made more pleasurable because ' Gill ' is someplace else on a coach is a bit below the belt don'tcha think. I may ask David to delete your post.

ps ... but of course ' Gill ' may not know about you and belts
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Thank gawd I read your post three times because having read it the first time I was online booking myself another ticket to Russia
Don’t remind me about the belt incident it taken me five years to get over it

[Gill W]

I don’t know about Keith’s belts...... the mind boggles

[david63]

Things could have been done differently accepts one's PM

Of course they could. I doubt that anyone, in any Government would say anything different.

People were just sauntering around with no regard for other people.

But that is, apparently, not a problem - the problem is being in close contact with somebody for an extended period. So just passing someone else in the street or supermarket never has been an issue.

[Mervyn and Trish]

Yes of course they could. With the benefit of hindsight.

And Starmer and Davey are putting the boot in. With the benefit of hindsight.

My question, posed before but as yet unanswered by the Bojo Bashers, is where were they in January, February, March, when they now claim Bojo should have been clairvoyant? My answer is nowhere. Invisible.

[Onelife]

Things could have been done differently accepts one's PM

Are you sure this isn’t fake news Mob?

If it isn’t, can someone turn the sound up as I want to hear all the bottom shuffling that must be going on after reading what I am sure for some makes uncomfortable reading. I just can’t wait to read some of the well-crafted replies.

But let’s give credit where credit due….Bos has taken sound advice from Dom in making this damage limitation exercise now…it’s a simple case of cushioning the blows for what will come later. But hey! it will go some way in showing his detractors that we all make mistakes especially when we are under immense pressure…. none more so than what this cabinet has been put under during this dreadful time in our lives.

An acceptance in acknowledging your mistakes is the best way forward....so he gets a from me.

I think Theresa probably had a quite word in his ear

[Onelife]

Yes of course they could. With the benefit of hindsight.

And Starmer and Davey are putting the boot in. With the benefit of hindsight.

My question, posed before but as yet unanswered by the Bojo Bashers, is where were they in January, February, March, when they now claim Bojo should have been clairvoyant? My answer is nowhere. Invisible.

Hi Sir Merv…I think it was back in late February/ early March when a couple of us were saying we should be taking this virus far more seriously that was the case…and for the record, I have never been a Bos Basher… I’ve just been highlighting the mistakes, mistakes which he has now acknowledged.

[Gill W]

Things could have been done differently accepts one's PM

Are you sure this isn’t fake news Mob?

If it isn’t, can someone turn the sound up as I want to hear all the bottom shuffling that must be going on after reading what I am sure for some makes uncomfortable reading. I just can’t wait to read some of the well-crafted replies.

But let’s give credit where credit due….Bos has taken sound advice from Dom in making this damage limitation exercise now…it’s a simple case of cushioning the blows for what will come later. But hey! it will go some way in showing his detractors that we all make mistakes especially when we are under immense pressure…. none more so than what this cabinet has been put under during this dreadful time in our lives.

An acceptance in acknowledging your mistakes is the best way forward....so he gets a from me.

I think Theresa probably had a quite word in his ear

I haven’t seen the full interview yet, but what I have seen made me think this is a change of tack from Cummings. A different tone is now being established.

That’s backed up by the fact that it was LK who was selected for this interview. Although she doesn’t seem popular around these parts, she seems to be well in with number 10. They trust her not to upset the apple cart too much

[Gill W]

Yes of course they could. With the benefit of hindsight.

And Starmer and Davey are putting the boot in. With the benefit of hindsight.

My question, posed before but as yet unanswered by the Bojo Bashers, is where were they in January, February, March, when they now claim Bojo should have been clairvoyant? My answer is nowhere. Invisible.

How is anybody ever going to talk about what happened in the past without hindsight?

When you posed your question before, I did comment that an absence of comment on this forum, did not necessarily mean an absence of thought. Certainly, in late February, I remember being perplexed by Johnson’s apparent disappearance from view as he was having what seemed an extended break at Chequers. I didn’t realise I had to post about it at the time in order to mention it later on.

I’m also getting confused about this concept of Boris Bashing. I keep seeing lots of posts about it, but not much actual ‘bashing’ is currently happening in this community

[towny44]

Gill, Keith, I do not see this interview as a change of tactics at all, Boris has been saying all along that when they have time to analyse the events surrounding this pandemic there will lots of things they will now feel could have been handled better. But he was still saying to LK that now was not the time because its not yet over,and he has also said several times that they have been continuously learning as they went along. However LKs desire to get him to agree that he should now acknowledge all the errors to ensure that things are done better in future, was equally rebuffed as being not the right time to be soul searching.
I realise that you will never agree that anything Boris does is right, but for me he has handled this as well as anyone faced with the appalling death rates that we have seen, and I feel confident that when any review is undertaken the real reasons for our heavy death rate will most likely absolve the govt, SAGE and even the cumbersome PHE, of any guilt in the way they handled the pandemic.

[Gill W]

Gill, Keith, I do not see this interview as a change of tactics at all, Boris has been saying all along that when they have time to analyse the events surrounding this pandemic there will lots of things they will now feel could have been handled better. But he was still saying to LK that now was not the time because its not yet over,and he has also said several times that they have been continuously learning as they went along. However LKs desire to get him to agree that he should now acknowledge all the errors to ensure that things are done better in future, was equally rebuffed as being not the right time to be soul searching.
I realise that you will never agree that anything Boris does is right, but for me he has handled this as well as anyone faced with the appalling death rates that we have seen, and I feel confident that when any review is undertaken the real reasons for our heavy death rate will most likely absolve the govt, SAGE and even the cumbersome PHE, of any guilt in the way they handled the pandemic.

The problem will be, that, if any enquiry does find the government to be in any way culpable, you more than likely won’t accept it.

There’s already a tendency on this forum to try to find reasons, other than government action ( or non action) to explain the terrible loss of life, whether it’s Climate, population density, obesity or people from ethnic minorities. All may have played a part, but I don’t think the government will come out of it smelling of roses.

However, an enquiry is for the future. Whilst the government do need to learn from what has happened so far, in order to shape their response, they now need to look to how they are going to manage the pandemic in the months ahead. The announcement of the extension of flu vaccinations would seem to be a positive step.

[Manoverboard]

The problem will be, that, if any enquiry does find the government to be in any way culpable, you more than likely won’t accept it.

There’s already a tendency on this forum to try to find reasons, other than government action ( or non action) to explain the terrible loss of life, whether it’s Climate, population density, obesity or people from ethnic minorities. All may have played a part, but I don’t think the government will come out of it smelling of roses.

You do come across as seeming to be absolutely desperate to pin something on this Tory Government whereas most, if not all, of the Tory supporting Members posting on this Topic readily accept that there were warts and errors that have been made. I am obviously a Bojo supporter but was entirely comfortable posting the link where he agrees that things could have been handled in a different way but that is because he and virtually everybody else recognises that when one is walking on untrodden ground one will trip up from time to time. It has all been a learning curve and that of course makes the Government an easy target for the opportunist snipers.

May I point out ( albeit with the powers of hindsight ) that I have yet to see, let alone enjoy, any link at all from your good self ( or that mangy poodle of yours ) anything about the failings of any of the opposition parties during this pandemic which leaves me to conclude that your posts are even more biased than the rest of us, that being the case please spare us the ongoing lectures regarding our own biases.
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[Manoverboard]

Don’t remind me about the belt incident it taken me five years to get over it

Given that it ' arose ' in 2011 may we assume that you enjoyed the memory for the first four years ?

[Stephen]

I can't wait for the day we can all start cruising again and have something more topical to talk about. I appreciate it is a 'Current Affairs' thread but we do seem to be going over the same ground again and again with constant point scoring attempts between certain members.

[Stephen]

Don’t remind me about the belt incident it taken me five years to get over it

Given that it ' arose ' in 2011 may we assume that you enjoyed the memory for the first four years ?

I was only trying to help him out. All I said to him in the hallway outside our cabin was pass me your belt and I'll see if I can put another hole in it for you. That's the sort of person I am, help anyone.

How was I to know he had a leather fetish. It was Mrs S's fault really for leaving the door a jar. Before I knew what was happening he was in the room, trousers off, spread eagled on the bed saying 'spank me baby'.

I just called security and went for a drink.

[johnds]

The problem will be, that, if any enquiry does find the government to be in any way culpable, you more than likely won’t accept it.

The problem will be, that, if any enquiry does not find the government to be in any way culpable, you more than likely won’t accept it.

[Onelife]

Yes of course they could. With the benefit of hindsight.

And Starmer and Davey are putting the boot in. With the benefit of hindsight.

My question, posed before but as yet unanswered by the Bojo Bashers, is where were they in January, February, March, when they now claim Bojo should have been clairvoyant? My answer is nowhere. Invisible.

How is anybody ever going to talk about what happened in the past without hindsight?

When you posed your question before, I did comment that an absence of comment on this forum, did not necessarily mean an absence of thought. Certainly, in late February, I remember being perplexed by Johnson’s apparent disappearance from view as he was having what seemed an extended break at Chequers. I didn’t realise I had to post about it at the time in order to mention it later on.

Hi Gill, I don’t think there was anything unusual in rolling out Laura as she tends to have the biggest megaphone when it comes headline stories such as this. All governments have used the same BBC platform to get their message across.

I can’t believe the Beep were very pleased with the way she conducted herself yesterday…. Bos put his head on the block in order to come clean, but all she wanted was blood. I seriously think her interview style needs to change or she’ll soon be out of a job.

I agree, it was a definite attempt to change tack, no doubt orchestrated by Dom and sanctioned by his worried cabinet. It is clear that the intention was to wipe the slate clean by way of acknowledging the things that could, should, and must be done better. And perhaps now is a good time to say to you that I think you may be right about Dom as I’m starting to think he may have had far too much influence in steering Boris down the wrong path…why do I thinks this? Well one of the reasons is that I don’t think the Covid meetings were stopped because of conflicting statistic reports, I think they were stopped because some of the speakers were getting increasingly uncomfortable with the way the Government wanted them to deliver the government message, and at the risk of one of them spilling the beans Dom decided to take them off the shelf.

So, in a nutshell this, imo was nothing more than a PR exercise in trying to win back the ground which has been lost both north of the border and in the home nations. He knows there is still a long way to go both dealing with Covid and Brexit and knows that having the four nations behind him will be crucial if he is going to achieve the best outcome for both.
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[Onelife]

Don’t remind me about the belt incident it taken me five years to get over it

Given that it ' arose ' in 2011 may we assume that you enjoyed the memory for the first four years ?

I was only trying to help him out. All I said to him in the hallway outside our cabin was pass me your belt and I'll see if I can put another hole in it for you. That's the sort of person I am, help anyone.

How was I to know he had a leather fetish. It was Mrs S's fault really for leaving the door a jar. Before I knew what was happening he was in the room, trousers off, spread eagled on the bed saying 'spank me baby'.

I just called security and went for a drink.

Stephen…. I’m not going to dispute your version of events because I haven’t laughed this much in eleven years

[Onelife]

Thanks for editing my post Shitsu Mob

[towny44]

Gill, Keith, I do not see this interview as a change of tactics at all, Boris has been saying all along that when they have time to analyse the events surrounding this pandemic there will lots of things they will now feel could have been handled better. But he was still saying to LK that now was not the time because its not yet over,and he has also said several times that they have been continuously learning as they went along. However LKs desire to get him to agree that he should now acknowledge all the errors to ensure that things are done better in future, was equally rebuffed as being not the right time to be soul searching.
I realise that you will never agree that anything Boris does is right, but for me he has handled this as well as anyone faced with the appalling death rates that we have seen, and I feel confident that when any review is undertaken the real reasons for our heavy death rate will most likely absolve the govt, SAGE and even the cumbersome PHE, of any guilt in the way they handled the pandemic.

The problem will be, that, if any enquiry does find the government to be in any way culpable, you more than likely won’t accept it.
I agree with my track record that's definitely possible.
There’s already a tendency on this forum to try to find reasons, other than government action ( or non action) to explain the terrible loss of life, whether it’s Climate, population density, obesity or people from ethnic minorities. All may have played a part, but I don’t think the government will come out of it smelling of roses.
Yes again I agree, but there are lots of reports now being issued that do indeed go a long way to explaining why the UK has such a high death rate, in fact one from Toronto Uni thinks that death rates have not been influenced by lockdown timing. There is also the distinct possibility that the UK stats have overstated our Covid deaths as compared to most other countries.
However, an enquiry is for the future. Whilst the government do need to learn from what has happened so far, in order to shape their response, they now need to look to how they are going to manage the pandemic in the months ahead. The announcement of the extension of flu vaccinations would seem to be a positive step.

I think we both agree that how well our track and trace, despite all its flaws and criticisms, helps to manage and control local fare ups, and prevent them escalating into a new nationwide spike, and how the govt and local authorities react, will decide whether we sink or swim.

[Gill W]

You do come across as seeming to be absolutely desperate to pin something on this Tory Government whereas most, if not all, of the Tory supporting Members posting on this Topic readily accept that there were warts and errors that have been made. I am obviously a Bojo supporter but was entirely comfortable posting the link where he agrees that things could have been handled in a different way but that is because he and virtually everybody else recognises that when one is walking on untrodden ground one will trip up from time to time. It has all been a learning curve and that of course makes the Government an easy target for the opportunist snipers.

May I point out ( albeit with the powers of hindsight ) that I have yet to see, let alone enjoy, any link at all from your good self ( or that mangy poodle of yours ) anything about the failings of any of the opposition parties during this pandemic which leaves me to conclude that your posts are even more biased than the rest of us, that being the case please spare us the ongoing lectures regarding our own biases.
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It's interesting that you use the word 'desperate'', because that's exactly the word I've had in my mind for some time, about some members of this forum. I've never actually said it tough, as I thought it might cause upset.

But, as the word is out in the open,I do feel, that when there is any negative story about the Conservative party, whether COVID 19 related or not, there's a mass mobilisation on the forum, all desperately trying to dismiss and diminish the story. It is quite something to behold, I have wondered just how bad the Tories would have to get before 'the usual suspects' would come out of the closet and say, 'enough is enough, this is not acceptable.

That interview with LK yesterday, I didn't think that was a negative story - my feeling was that it was a Dominic Cummings planned change of tone.

From my point of view, my main interest at present is COVID 19 and the way it is being dealt with. The opposition parties aren't responsible for policy, so I have little interest in what they are doing, so I don't bother to look for news about them. As I've said many times, I'm not a party political animal, so I don't actively seek information about them at the best of times. My position at the moment is that I don't care one way or the other what Labour or the Lib Dems are doing - I'm sorry if that's seen as a bias, but that's my position.

If you mean Keith, he's not mangy!!

[Gill W]

Hi Gill, I don’t think there was anything unusual in rolling out Laura as she tends to have the biggest megaphone when it comes headline stories such as this. All governments have used the same BBC platform to get their message across.

I can’t believe the Beep were very pleased with the way she conducted herself yesterday…. Bos put his head on the block in order to come clean, but all she wanted was blood. I seriously think her interview style needs to change or she’ll soon be out of a job.

I agree, it was a definite attempt to change tack, no doubt orchestrated by Dom and sanctioned by his worried cabinet. It is clear that the intention was to wipe the slate clean by way of acknowledging the things that could, should, and must be done better. And perhaps now is a good time to say to you that I think you may be right about Dom as I’m starting to think he may have had far too much influence in steering Boris down the wrong path…why do I thinks this? Well one of the reasons is that I don’t think the Covid meetings were stopped because of conflicting statistic reports, I think they were stopped because some of the speakers were getting increasingly uncomfortable with the way the Government wanted them to deliver the government message, and at the risk of one of them spilling the beans Dom decided to take them off the shelf.

So, in a nutshell this, imo was nothing more than a PR exercise in trying to win back the ground which has been lost both north of the border and in the home nations. He knows there is still a long way to go both dealing with Covid and Brexit and knows that having the four nations behind him will be crucial if he is going to achieve the best outcome for both.
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I think Cummings is a very unsavoury individual, who, as an unelected advisor has far too much power. I do believe it is Cummings pulling the strings and calling the shots.

I also agree about the Daily Briefings - they had become little more than party political broadcasts, and the medical and scientists were looking increasingly unhappy about being there.

As far as I know, Cummings isn't a member of the Conservative party, so there is no real need for him to be defended on this forum.