Young girl drowns in Sharm

[Mo2013]

I don't know why this little girl died so I cannot comment and I don't know why members are criticising other people's posts, because IMO this is not a subject to bicker about or even give an opinion on, since no-one knows all the facts. There is no use iffing and butting about it either, if the little one had been in school or not, what's the point of that? What is done is done. I just feel tremendous sadness for the family concerned. And, although I have the choice to read or not, or contribute or not, to a thread, I still have the right opine that this subject is not one to tittle-tattle about. Would any of you like some strangers on a forum to be gossiping about YOUR family tragedy ?

[Silver_Shiney]

I don't know why this little girl died so I cannot comment and I don't know why members are criticising other people's posts, because IMO this is not a subject to bicker about or even give an opinion on, since no-one knows all the facts. There is no use iffing and butting about it either, if the little one had been in school or not, what's the point of that? What is done is done. I just feel tremendous sadness for the family concerned. And, although I have the choice to read or not, or contribute or not, to a thread, I still have the right opine that this subject is not one to tittle-tattle about. Would any of you like some strangers on a forum to be gossiping about YOUR family tragedy ?

Mo, this is the second time we've agreed!

[Silver_Shiney]

SS, My post was with regard to a dreadful accident that has occurred and a comment about a child being on holiday instead of school should be off no concern to anyone.
The pain of losing their Daughter will be with them forever.

Andrea, please read Em's and my posts again.

[Manoverboard]

It is very difficult, impossible actually, to please everybody.

Silver Shiney, aka Alan, has a very valid point and perhaps believes that the Mods should have culled this Topic yet it does also offer a reminder to all our Members who have small children / grand children in tow on our holidays that we need to be vigilant at all times.

We have children, one of whom we lost, and grand children but have no problems discussing this tragic event although I also respect that others will have a different view.

[Boris+]

Ok, so if people wish to have a go at me because I made a remark (and this is a hugely sad incident) about the child possibly being on holiday when perhaps it shouldn't have been.

Put that to one side, there still remains the problem that someone wasn't watching this child properly, and that water (from garden ponds to the big wide ocean) is not (repeat not) a plaything ..... it is dangerous and must be respected. Additionally, cliffs and mountains are similarly dangerous.

I am not saying 'I told you so' - I learned the hard way, and I just earnestly wish that people would be a bit more wary with pools etc., and a little less-trusting of what they assume their own abilities are. None of us are Superman or Batman, and prevention is better than loss.

Em

[Mr-big-bits-mk2]

Unfortunatly a busy pool can give a false sense of security. It looks busy with lots of people which gives the impression of being safe however the problem is is that if a child does get into trouble it can be much harder to notice. One chld in a pool all on their own will stand out especialy if there is a problem, put them in a pool with hundreds of others with the same problem and no one will notice in the mayhem and chaos.

Life guards are there as an extra level of security but should by no means replace the level of protection given by a parent or guardian. A parent/guardian has just a child or two to keep and eye on, a life guard may have hundreds.

[gfwgfw]

I hesitate to post further on this very sad incident

But

I would give our moderators much kudos if this particular thread was pulled

Thank you

[Dancing Queen]

I don't disagree with you very often Graham but in this instance I do, if for no other reason that the parents and grandparents on here will be even more aware.

Yes we all have our own opinion but I do think thus far there has not been any reason for the thread to even be considered being closed.

No-one is trying to apportion blame but for the question to be raised "where were the parents" imo is not unreasonable, was it not unreasonable for the grandmother to blame the lack of lifeguards, it is a very very sad situation with the result the death of a little girl and everyone whether it be the parents, the hotel or the travel company will have to live with the question - could it have been avoided, hopefully lessons will be learned.

[gfwgfw]

Dear Jo

I do respect your reply I truly do

BUT

We have gone through the AGONIES ourselves

Condolences yes

But pointing fingers before the official inquest no

Sorry - and I am out of here

Luboo

Graham

[Mo2013]

I think some topics are raised just to engender debate and discussion whether or not they are in poor taste, and I think the topic is in poor taste. Some posts do seem to infer something by asking where the parents were. As I say, none of us have the full picture, and therefore pointing fingers and comments are insensitive speculation and gossip. If by chance any of that family were to read some of this stuff, how do you think they would feel? I have no wish to participate any further in this thread.

[Manoverboard]

Some have concerns about this Topic but others, including me, do not but I will pull it if the OP requests it ... and yes I do know who the OP is.

[ChesterfieldJohn]

Dear Jo

I do respect your reply I truly do

BUT

We have gone through the AGONIES ourselves

Condolences yes

But pointing fingers before the official inquest no

Sorry - and I am out of here

Luboo

Graham

I agree completely what a self righteous lot some are on here.

especially the ones who obviously have no children.

Condolences to the family involved.

[Dancing Queen]

Dear Jo

I do respect your reply I truly do

BUT

We have gone through the AGONIES ourselves

Condolences yes

But pointing fingers before the official inquest no

Sorry - and I am out of here

Luboo

Graham

I agree completely what a self righteous lot some are on here.

especially the ones who obviously have no children.

Condolences to the family involved.

Correct John, I do not have children but I do have step children and step grand children , I also have nieces and nephews and I would lay down and die for any of them.

I don't see anyone being self righteous, nor am I making accusations, I merely asked where the parents were, if you or anyone else thinks that is unreasonable then perhaps you should question your own reasons for doing so.

[Onelife]

Unfortunatly a busy pool can give a false sense of security. It looks busy with lots of people which gives the impression of being safe however the problem is is that if a child does get into trouble it can be much harder to notice. One chld in a pool all on their own will stand out especialy if there is a problem, put them in a pool with hundreds of others with the same problem and no one will notice in the mayhem and chaos.

Life guards are there as an extra level of security but should by no means replace the level of protection given by a parent or guardian. A parent/guardian has just a child or two to keep and eye on, a life guard may have hundreds.

Misterbigbits

In my opinion your “excellent” post say’s everything that needs to be said about this tragic case...people will draw their own conclusions as to how this tragedy could have been prevented.

...............

I believe this thread should be allowed to run its course.

Regards

OL

[ChesterfieldJohn]

Dear Jo

I do respect your reply I truly do

BUT

We have gone through the AGONIES ourselves

Condolences yes

But pointing fingers before the official inquest no

Sorry - and I am out of here

Luboo

Graham

I agree completely what a self righteous lot some are on here.

especially the ones who obviously have no children.

Condolences to the family involved.

Correct John, I do not have children but I do have step children and step grand children , I also have nieces and nephews and I would lay down and die for any of them.

I don't see anyone being self righteous, nor am I making accusations, I merely asked where the parents were, if you or anyone else thinks that is unreasonable then perhaps you should question your own reasons for doing so.

My reasons are for respect of the family and of the little girl herself, a tragic accident which should be treated as such and not an excuse to proportion blame or question what the parents were doing.

[JenniC]

DQ and OL - very well put posts - As DQ I also have children, grandchildren, nieces and nephews and I too would lay down my life for them. Each year we go on holiday with our family and no way would we let Chloe (6) in the pool without an adult - just would not happen, so find it hard to comprehend someone allowing it - not apportioning blame as this is just too tragic to do that, but wondering all the same.

[Dancing Queen]

Dear Jo

I do respect your reply I truly do

BUT

We have gone through the AGONIES ourselves

Condolences yes

But pointing fingers before the official inquest no

Sorry - and I am out of here

Luboo

Graham

I agree completely what a self righteous lot some are on here.

especially the ones who obviously have no children.

Condolences to the family involved.

Correct John, I do not have children but I do have step children and step grand children , I also have nieces and nephews and I would lay down and die for any of them.

I don't see anyone being self righteous, nor am I making accusations, I merely asked where the parents were, if you or anyone else thinks that is unreasonable then perhaps you should question your own reasons for doing so.

My reasons are for respect of the family and of the little girl herself, a tragic accident which should be treated as such and not an excuse to proportion blame or question what the parents were doing.

And so are mine, yes a tragic accident and as I've already said I am certainly not proportioning blame, if it is ok for the grandmother to ask "where were the lifeguards" then I see nothing wrong in asking where the parents were, why should you think I would be treating it as anything but a tragic accident, please don't read into something that isn't there.

[ChesterfieldJohn]

Jo,

I don't believe that I am reading anything in to it.
I just feel that asking questions on here is inappropriate.

The grandmother is probably asking the questions when she was in an emotional state, understandably so.

The original post criticised the grandmother right from the start, surely this is wrong before even all the facts were known.

This was in actual fact where my comments were aimed.

John

[Dancing Queen]

Jo,

I don't believe that I am reading anything in to it.
I just feel that asking questions on here is inappropriate.

The grandmother is probably asking the questions when she was in an emotional state, understandably so.

The original post criticised the grandmother right from the start, surely this is wrong before even all the facts were known.

This was in actual fact where my comments were aimed.

John

I think we will have to agree to disagree John, I think the grandmother was wrong to say what she did but that is just my opinion and at the end of the day it matters not if I think she was wrong or if you think I am wrong for asking where the parents were it doesn't alter the fact that a little girl has died and it might have been preventable, I think there will always be emotion shown especially when children are involved and like it or not people do have opinions whether appropriate or not.

I personally don't feel anyone has made an inappropriate comment.

Hindsight in any situation is a wonderful thing so on that note I will "bow out" of any further discussion on this thread.

[ChesterfieldJohn]

Jo,

I don't believe that I am reading anything in to it.
I just feel that asking questions on here is inappropriate.

The grandmother is probably asking the questions when she was in an emotional state, understandably so.

The original post criticised the grandmother right from the start, surely this is wrong before even all the facts were known.

This was in actual fact where my comments were aimed.

John

I think we will have to agree to disagree John, I think the grandmother was wrong to say what she did but that is just my opinion and at the end of the day it matters not if I think she was wrong or if you think I am wrong for asking where the parents were it doesn't alter the fact that a little girl has died and it might have been preventable, I think there will always be emotion shown especially when children are involved and like it or not people do have opinions whether appropriate or not.

I personally don't feel anyone has made an inappropriate comment.

Hindsight in any situation is a wonderful thing so on that note I will "bow out" of any further discussion on this thread.

Ok I agree to disagree

[Kendhni]

I personally don't feel anyone has made an inappropriate comment.

It actually was a reasonable discussion up until the sanctimonious posts started arriving (most of which were more about getting digs in at others than any attempt at taking true moral high ground).

Sorry you got swept up in such an attempt Jo.

[Mo2013]

I personally don't feel anyone has made an inappropriate comment.

It actually was a reasonable discussion up until the sanctimonious posts started arriving (most of which were more about getting digs in at others than any attempt at taking true moral high ground).

Sorry you got swept up in such an attempt Jo.

'Sanctimonious'? You are the original poster and unfortunately for you some people deemed your thread insensitive and inappropriate. I disagree with you totally that some responses are sanctimonious and are more about getting digs in. In my opinion sincere and heartfelt views have been expressed and should not be seen as anything else. Certainly my own views are sincerely held. A discussion will always be reasonable as long as people accept and respect other views without resorting to accusations as to the sincerity of some comments.

[ChesterfieldJohn]

I personally don't feel anyone has made an inappropriate comment.

It actually was a reasonable discussion up until the sanctimonious posts started arriving (most of which were more about getting digs in at others than any attempt at taking true moral high ground).

Sorry you got swept up in such an attempt Jo.

From the most sanctimonious person on the board this would be funny if the subject weren't so sensitive.

Read the posts most said that this was not a subject to proportion blame or question the parents.

John

[Kendhni]

If people consider the thread to be insensitive then that is perfectly fine, and is their opinion and to be respected. What I don't understand is continually posting on it for the very reasons they claim we should not be posting on it? You only have to look at how some posts are worded and it is obvious that the primary reason for posting was not about the family but to get digs at other posters.

Up until the sanctimonious posts the thread was basically a reasonable discussion. If people do not like the subject matter then start your own threads about topics that are of interest to you.

[Mo2013]

I don't think that people have continually posted on it. One may not like a thread but one is still entitled to post an opinion expressing their dismay. I'm afraid Ken that rather than other people, you yourself have rendered the thread unreasonable. Your remarks about people using their posts to get digs in at others is regrettable and can only serve to unsettle people and completely off topic.